3G also restricted on new Paperwhite?

terencek · 09-07-2012, 10:14 PM

Can anyone confirm what I suspect to be the case but cannot quite work out from the Amazon Kindle pages: that the 3G model is again restricted to free browsing of only the Amazon and Wikipedia sites (unlike the K3s which featured unrestricted browsing)? Thanks!

jocampo · 09-07-2012, 10:21 PM

Based on a totally different post in Amazon site, about landscape mode, it looks the Kindle Paperwhite uses same firmware, so I'm assuming it will be limited. But do you really care?

Kindle It's for reading.

If you find yourself using it way more for internet, maybe is the wrong device for you. Maybe a tablet is what you need, or a cellphone.

soulfuldog · 09-08-2012, 09:28 AM

There's been no confirmation, but it's highly unlikely that they'll revert back to allowing unlimited 3G access. They stopped it for a reason, no point kidding yourself it'll ever be back.

JoHunt · 09-09-2012, 04:30 AM

From the product page:

Kindle Paperwhite 3G enables you to connect to the Kindle Store and access Wikipedia - all over 3G or Wi-Fi. Experimental web browsing on other websites is only available over Wi-Fi.

A $60 premium seems a bit excessive.

avinatbezeq · 09-09-2012, 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jocampo

Based on a totally different post in Amazon site, about landscape mode, it looks the Kindle Paperwhite uses same firmware, so I'm assuming it will be limited. But do you really care?

Kindle It's for reading.

If you find yourself using it way more for internet, maybe is the wrong device for you. Maybe a tablet is what you need, or a cellphone.

I totally care. I want to be able to read http://my.safaribooksonline.com/ using kindle.

jocampo · 09-09-2012, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avinatbezeq

I totally care. I want to be able to read http://my.safaribooksonline.com/ using kindle.

Not a good idea, in my opinion, as you are not reading a true ebook format, but browsing Internet. eink readers are not for that. Casual email and Wikipedia is different.

While you are entitle to do it though, you are going to pass the 3G limit way faster than if you do not.

A tablet with a data plan you are actually paying, maybe be better, but again, it's up to you.

I do not work for Amazon, but it is important for people to understand the limitations and what the 3G is actually there for. I feel blessed that I can actually download books, use Wikipedia, even if I'm out of USA, for free! But if people start to abuse or hack it somehow, we all will soon end with nothing.

Zimmy · 09-10-2012, 03:31 PM

Yea, Amazon updated its page and finally admitted it is the same restriction as the Touch 3G.

It's disappointing since they raised the premium from $50 to $60 when the hardware is probably the same and much cheaper.

I would have preferred they went with unlimited store/wiki and 50megs a month for other.

If they are making it store only, the premium should be $20 tops.

To anyone buying the 3G version of Paperwhite, you are basically paying for the abuse of the K3 3G users.

geekmaster · 09-10-2012, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zimmy

...
To anyone buying the 3G version of Paperwhite, you are basically paying for the abuse of the K3 3G users.

Like this guy in the Hackaday post about Kindle 3G tethering:

Quote:

HackJack says:
February 27, 2012 at 6:53 pm
Why is everyone acting like this is the first bit of news posted about this? People have been doing this for a LONG time and there are MANY tutorials out there on how to do it.

I’ve been tethered to my kindle for 6 months, using it as my main internet connection. With browsing and utorrent I’ve racked up over 46GB. No disconnection here!

Zimmy · 09-10-2012, 04:25 PM

So instead of updating the device to deal with the abusers or change the policy that helps the non abusers, Amazon choose the easy route and killed it for everyone.

I'm sure there wouldn't be much uproar if they just say, unlimited store and only 50megs for anything else per month.

How hard is it to write the UI that makes sure internet requests come from the device or block torrent ports???

tomsem · 09-10-2012, 05:06 PM

The 3G premium has been going up ($40 for KK, $50 for KT, now $60 for KPW), but I think it is speculative to say this is due to abuse, and not simply an attempt on amazon's part to 'align interests' (avoid losing money on the offer of free 3G, while offering a superior 'extended' reading experience).

The newer Kindles have more web-powered reading features than KK did, and these are easier to access. Wikipedia lookup, for example, used to require launching the browser, but is now integrated into the reading app (for showing article summary). FB/Twitter sharing is more friction free. Also they have added Bing Translate and Report Content Error. All of these still work over 3G. They may be planning to add more web-enabled features for KPW, or they expect people to use them more as they discover them. Every time they add such features, they have to anticipate what the cost is in terms of 3G overhead, since they have to build that into the cost of the devices with that feature over its entire lifetime.

soulfuldog · 09-10-2012, 05:24 PM

The bottom line is that there must be costs incurred by Amazon for providing 3G access. If they charge $50 more for the 3G Kindle but the average cost of the 3G over the lifetime of it's use is $100, they're probably pretty happy to take that hit just to make it easy for you to buy books from Amazon, and if they can enhance your reading experience with little things like Wikipedia access, then that's fine too.

Clearly allowing standard web access makes the sums not add up for them. It doesn't even have to be down to some of the OTT abuse you hear about, they might just not have expected so many people to want to access the internet quite so much.

Perhaps they should consider offering people a 3G subscription service for a fee, that seems to be the only solution.

anathema · 09-10-2012, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zimmy

So instead of updating the device to deal with the abusers or change the policy that helps the non abusers, Amazon choose the easy route and killed it for everyone.

I'm sure there wouldn't be much uproar if they just say, unlimited store and only 50megs for anything else per month.

How hard is it to write the UI that makes sure internet requests come from the device or block torrent ports???

They do. Once you hit the limit you can only use store, browse wikipedia, etc. It is still unlimited for those things.

geekmaster · 09-10-2012, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anathema

They do. Once you hit the limit you can only use store, browse wikipedia, etc. It is still unlimited for those things.

I believe that limit (50MB) does not apply while in the USA.

MBRO95 · 09-10-2012, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jocampo

Not a good idea, in my opinion, as you are not reading a true ebook format, but browsing Internet. eink readers are not for that. Casual email and Wikipedia is different.

While you are entitle to do it though, you are going to pass the 3G limit way faster than if you do not.

A tablet with a data plan you are actually paying, maybe be better, but again, it's up to you.

I do not work for Amazon, but it is important for people to understand the limitations and what the 3G is actually there for. I feel blessed that I can actually download books, use Wikipedia, even if I'm out of USA, for free! But if people start to abuse or hack it somehow, we all will soon end with nothing.

You're quite a [Personal attack deleted - MODERATOR.]

SteveEisenberg · 09-10-2012, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zimmy

So instead of updating the device to deal with the abusers or change the policy that helps the non abusers, Amazon choose the easy route and killed it for everyone.

Maybe one day they will kill it for everyone. But Amazon is still selling new Kindle Keyboard 3G devices, in the US, for $139 with special offers and $159 (a recent price reduction, I think) without. And amazon.com still offers, through third parties, older used devices, also with free cell-phone-network internet, for around half that.

Until the Paperwhite 3G is independently reviewed by people who care about this issue, we can't answer the thread title's question.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zimmy

How hard is it to write the UI that makes sure internet requests come from the device or block torrent ports???

So that it works for a month, probably easy. So that the hacker community can't come up with a workaround, probably damn near impossible. Or, maybe, too expensive to implement as it would require custom chips.

I'm a big fan of the webkit browser, as can be seen from posts in the Links Every Kindle Owner Should Have thread.

09-07-2012, 10:14 PM	#1
terencek Groupie Posts: 170 Karma: 1010944 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: The African bush Device: Kindle 3	3G also restricted on new Paperwhite? Can anyone confirm what I suspect to be the case but cannot quite work out from the Amazon Kindle pages: that the 3G model is again restricted to free browsing of only the Amazon and Wikipedia sites (unlike the K3s which featured unrestricted browsing)? Thanks!

09-09-2012, 04:30 AM	#4
JoHunt I am what I am Posts: 6,625 Karma: 62235665 Join Date: Sep 2011 Device: iPad3, Voyage	From the product page: Kindle Paperwhite 3G enables you to connect to the Kindle Store and access Wikipedia - all over 3G or Wi-Fi. Experimental web browsing on other websites is only available over Wi-Fi. A $60 premium seems a bit excessive. Last edited by JoHunt; 09-09-2012 at 04:38 AM.

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09-07-2012, 10:21 PM	#2
jocampo Layback feline Posts: 3,034 Karma: 6980745 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: USA Device: Oasis 2nd gen, Sony DPTS1, iPad Pro 10.5"	Based on a totally different post in Amazon site, about landscape mode, it looks the Kindle Paperwhite uses same firmware, so I'm assuming it will be limited. But do you really care? Kindle It's for reading. If you find yourself using it way more for internet, maybe is the wrong device for you. Maybe a tablet is what you need, or a cellphone.

09-08-2012, 09:28 AM	#3
soulfuldog I ♥ Calibre Posts: 2,073 Karma: 5678911 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis, Voyage, Sony PRS-350, Hudl2	There's been no confirmation, but it's highly unlikely that they'll revert back to allowing unlimited 3G access. They stopped it for a reason, no point kidding yourself it'll ever be back.

09-10-2012, 03:31 PM	#7
Zimmy Connoisseur Posts: 66 Karma: 504022 Join Date: Feb 2012 Device: Kindle Touch	Yea, Amazon updated its page and finally admitted it is the same restriction as the Touch 3G. It's disappointing since they raised the premium from $50 to $60 when the hardware is probably the same and much cheaper. I would have preferred they went with unlimited store/wiki and 50megs a month for other. If they are making it store only, the premium should be $20 tops. To anyone buying the 3G version of Paperwhite, you are basically paying for the abuse of the K3 3G users.

09-10-2012, 04:25 PM	#9
Zimmy Connoisseur Posts: 66 Karma: 504022 Join Date: Feb 2012 Device: Kindle Touch	So instead of updating the device to deal with the abusers or change the policy that helps the non abusers, Amazon choose the easy route and killed it for everyone. I'm sure there wouldn't be much uproar if they just say, unlimited store and only 50megs for anything else per month. How hard is it to write the UI that makes sure internet requests come from the device or block torrent ports???

09-10-2012, 05:06 PM	#10
tomsem Grand Sorcerer Posts: 6,742 Karma: 26974049 Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: USA Device: iPhone 15PM, Kindle Scribe, iPad mini 6, PocketBook InkPad Color 3	The 3G premium has been going up ($40 for KK, $50 for KT, now $60 for KPW), but I think it is speculative to say this is due to abuse, and not simply an attempt on amazon's part to 'align interests' (avoid losing money on the offer of free 3G, while offering a superior 'extended' reading experience). The newer Kindles have more web-powered reading features than KK did, and these are easier to access. Wikipedia lookup, for example, used to require launching the browser, but is now integrated into the reading app (for showing article summary). FB/Twitter sharing is more friction free. Also they have added Bing Translate and Report Content Error. All of these still work over 3G. They may be planning to add more web-enabled features for KPW, or they expect people to use them more as they discover them. Every time they add such features, they have to anticipate what the cost is in terms of 3G overhead, since they have to build that into the cost of the devices with that feature over its entire lifetime.

09-10-2012, 05:24 PM	#11
soulfuldog I ♥ Calibre Posts: 2,073 Karma: 5678911 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis, Voyage, Sony PRS-350, Hudl2	The bottom line is that there must be costs incurred by Amazon for providing 3G access. If they charge $50 more for the 3G Kindle but the average cost of the 3G over the lifetime of it's use is $100, they're probably pretty happy to take that hit just to make it easy for you to buy books from Amazon, and if they can enhance your reading experience with little things like Wikipedia access, then that's fine too. Clearly allowing standard web access makes the sums not add up for them. It doesn't even have to be down to some of the OTT abuse you hear about, they might just not have expected so many people to want to access the internet quite so much. Perhaps they should consider offering people a 3G subscription service for a fee, that seems to be the only solution.

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