Customizable Toolbars yes/no?

user_none · 03-10-2012, 11:37 PM

I've started working in integrating a new BookView (BV) editor this weekend. I have a proof of concept working so this is going to happen. There is still quite a bit of work to get it fully integrated but before I get too far into it I want to get some community feedback on the toolbars in particular.

A bit of background on the new editor. It's powered by CKEditor (CKE). One of the reasons I decided on it because it has HTML5 support (will be necessary for EPUB 3). TinyMCE was the other major contender but TinyMCE had serious performance issues.

Due to the design of CKE I will be including it in Sigil as files in the installation directory instead of embedding it in the executable. This the same as how dictionaries and translation files are currently distributed. With that in mind CKE has a configuration file which allows for customizing the look and behavior of the component to a great extent.

Sigil currently has a set of tool bars for changing the formatting in BV. CKE provides its own toolbars for this very same purpose. I can remove CKE's and hook the toolbars from the ain window into CKE. This isn't difficult but it will be more work to do this. The alternative is to remove the formatting toolbars form the main window and use CKE's. This is easier but detracts from the overall look of the application. FYI, I have no intention of making the formatting toolbars work in CodeView (CV) in the future.

Now back to that configuration file CKE has. It allows you to specify toolbars! You specify what you want and where you want them. What I can do is have a default config file in the installation folder and allow for user configuration files that would override the global one. Just like we do with dictionaries. I haven't looked into what else CKE allows to be configured via the config file but I'm sure there are other things it allows.

So, what do you think? Keep the current toolbar or use the CKE toolbar?

theducks · 03-11-2012, 12:26 AM

I am not married to the current toolbar, I have customized it to my use patterns (see image).

What I would like is to hide or at least remove the Icons that hog screen space.

Personally, if I had the ability to choose which appear on the right-click menu, I could lose most of them from the toolbar (just about anything that affects the Text. Alignment, font style, Selected heading, Indent (blockquote) are right click candidates .
The reason for my bar locations is Short Mouse arrow throws

jbacelar · 03-11-2012, 04:10 AM

Go ahead with the CKE toolbar.

Thank you John!

Toxaris · 03-11-2012, 06:15 AM

Looks fine John, although I hardly use the BookView. One thing which I personally would like to have is a dropdown box with all the styles I have.

Perkin · 03-11-2012, 07:45 AM

CKE looks good and more powerful than what we have - especially for only BV users, would we also be able to customise the styles dropdown box?

mmat1 · 03-11-2012, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by user_none

Sigil currently has a set of tool bars for changing the formatting in BV.

Since editing in BV is a bit "adventurous", i barely use them.

Things may change if a new BV is implemented. Customizable toolbars of the new BV would be nice.

meme · 03-11-2012, 09:13 AM

If you are going to use CKE, then it makes sense to use its toolbars.

If the editing buttons only apply to BV, then it might not hurt the look of the application much if at all - it just puts the buttons on the BV window and no longer shows greyed out buttons for CV. And in split view it makes it clearer that the buttons are only for BV.

mrmikel · 03-11-2012, 09:29 AM

Go for the CKE toolbars. People have described how different their workflows are, so having configurable toolbars makes sense.

Also thank you for changing the bookview editor. It has so many odd quirks none of which have endeared themselves to me. It is time for a new set of quirks! (grin)

I notice that plug ins are supported by this editor. I don't know how I would use any of those listed, but will they be available in Sigil if one of them seems to be useful?

DiapDealer · 03-11-2012, 09:36 AM

I can't honestly say whether I've ever even clicked a button on the Book View toolbar before.

But I say, if you can offer toolbar customization with no loss of stability/performance, then certainly go with CKE.

But you probably need more input from those who live in Book View.

Serpentine · 03-11-2012, 01:11 PM

I've never liked webcrap in apps. Using CKEditor in IPB makes me absolutely hate IPB. I know many users of IPB forums that just disable js and post in direct html to avoid it.

It's also the BookView, something which you said you didn't want to really focus on or try to make feature complete. But then again, it's not my time and you should feel free to do whatever you feel comfy with

Zeypxi · 03-11-2012, 04:37 PM

Not using a lot BV, in fact only to quickly check the result of my coding. However I wouldn't say no to that "Insert Link" toolbar icon!

Hitch · 03-11-2012, 06:59 PM

Must say...

I only use BV to do a quick check on any fast stuff I've done in the last-minute tweaking...I never use it myself, I live in CV. With regard to Toxaris' suggestion vis-a-vis a styles dropdown, I don't see how that could work unless this gets turned into Jutoh; it already has header styles and "normal," and anything after that--at least for me--starts to require custom lists thereof, and can't really be applied in BV, anyway (unless we're going to apply "styles" like they do in Word or Jutoh...but that gets me back to "I hate that idea.") If we're going to have applicable styles (or coding with opening and closing tags of any kind, above and beyond what's already there), I'd just as soon have something more like NoteTab Pro's usage and less like Jutoh, FWIW; wherein we could create customized clips which apply the styles we create; dock the clips to the editor...now, that might be useful. Of course--again, I'm talking CV, not BV.

Not sure that helps...

Hitch

Toxaris · 03-12-2012, 03:22 AM

I agree. I spent 95% of my time in CodeView. However, I can imagine people wanting to have that style dropbox. I personally would not care.

Laurencej · 03-13-2012, 10:27 AM

My vote: "use the CKE toolbar." And drop or hide the other.

03-10-2012, 11:37 PM	#1
user_none Sigil & calibre developer Posts: 2,487 Karma: 1063785 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Florida, USA Device: Nook STR	Customizable Toolbars yes/no? I've started working in integrating a new BookView (BV) editor this weekend. I have a proof of concept working so this is going to happen. There is still quite a bit of work to get it fully integrated but before I get too far into it I want to get some community feedback on the toolbars in particular. A bit of background on the new editor. It's powered by CKEditor (CKE). One of the reasons I decided on it because it has HTML5 support (will be necessary for EPUB 3). TinyMCE was the other major contender but TinyMCE had serious performance issues. Due to the design of CKE I will be including it in Sigil as files in the installation directory instead of embedding it in the executable. This the same as how dictionaries and translation files are currently distributed. With that in mind CKE has a configuration file which allows for customizing the look and behavior of the component to a great extent. Sigil currently has a set of tool bars for changing the formatting in BV. CKE provides its own toolbars for this very same purpose. I can remove CKE's and hook the toolbars from the ain window into CKE. This isn't difficult but it will be more work to do this. The alternative is to remove the formatting toolbars form the main window and use CKE's. This is easier but detracts from the overall look of the application. FYI, I have no intention of making the formatting toolbars work in CodeView (CV) in the future. Now back to that configuration file CKE has. It allows you to specify toolbars! You specify what you want and where you want them. What I can do is have a default config file in the installation folder and allow for user configuration files that would override the global one. Just like we do with dictionaries. I haven't looked into what else CKE allows to be configured via the config file but I'm sure there are other things it allows. So, what do you think? Keep the current toolbar or use the CKE toolbar?

03-11-2012, 12:26 AM	#2
theducks Well trained by Cats Posts: 30,659 Karma: 58055868 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Central Coast of California Device: Kobo Libra2,Kobo Aura2v1, K4NT(Fixed: New Bat.), Galaxy Tab A	I am not married to the current toolbar, I have customized it to my use patterns (see image). What I would like is to hide or at least remove the Icons that hog screen space. Personally, if I had the ability to choose which appear on the right-click menu, I could lose most of them from the toolbar (just about anything that affects the Text. Alignment, font style, Selected heading, Indent (blockquote) are right click candidates . The reason for my bar locations is Short Mouse arrow throws Attached Thumbnails

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03-11-2012, 04:10 AM	#3
jbacelar Interested in the matter Posts: 421 Karma: 426094 Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Spain, south coast Device: Pocketbook InkPad 3	Go ahead with the CKE toolbar. Thank you John!

03-11-2012, 06:15 AM	#4
Toxaris Wizard Posts: 4,520 Karma: 121692313 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Heemskerk, NL Device: PRS-T1, Kobo Touch, Kobo Aura	Looks fine John, although I hardly use the BookView. One thing which I personally would like to have is a dropdown box with all the styles I have.

03-11-2012, 07:45 AM	#5
Perkin Guru Posts: 657 Karma: 64171 Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Kent, England, Sol 3, ZZ9 plural Z Alpha Device: Sony PRS-300, Kobo Aura HD, iPad (Marvin)	CKE looks good and more powerful than what we have - especially for only BV users, would we also be able to customise the styles dropdown box?

03-11-2012, 09:13 AM	#7
meme Sigil developer Posts: 1,274 Karma: 1101600 Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: UK Device: Kindle PW, K4 NT, K3, Kobo Touch	If you are going to use CKE, then it makes sense to use its toolbars. If the editing buttons only apply to BV, then it might not hurt the look of the application much if at all - it just puts the buttons on the BV window and no longer shows greyed out buttons for CV. And in split view it makes it clearer that the buttons are only for BV.

03-11-2012, 09:29 AM	#8
mrmikel Color me gone Posts: 2,089 Karma: 1445295 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Central Oregon Coast Device: PRS-300	Go for the CKE toolbars. People have described how different their workflows are, so having configurable toolbars makes sense. Also thank you for changing the bookview editor. It has so many odd quirks none of which have endeared themselves to me. It is time for a new set of quirks! (grin) I notice that plug ins are supported by this editor. I don't know how I would use any of those listed, but will they be available in Sigil if one of them seems to be useful?

03-11-2012, 09:36 AM	#9
DiapDealer Grand Sorcerer Posts: 28,175 Karma: 201721072 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD	I can't honestly say whether I've ever even clicked a button on the Book View toolbar before. But I say, if you can offer toolbar customization with no loss of stability/performance, then certainly go with CKE. But you probably need more input from those who live in Book View.

03-11-2012, 01:11 PM	#10
Serpentine Evangelist Posts: 416 Karma: 1045911 Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Cape Town, South Africa Device: Kindle 3	I've never liked webcrap in apps. Using CKEditor in IPB makes me absolutely hate IPB. I know many users of IPB forums that just disable js and post in direct html to avoid it. It's also the BookView, something which you said you didn't want to really focus on or try to make feature complete. But then again, it's not my time and you should feel free to do whatever you feel comfy with

03-11-2012, 04:37 PM	#11
Zeypxi Member Posts: 23 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2011 Device: none	Not using a lot BV, in fact only to quickly check the result of my coding. However I wouldn't say no to that "Insert Link" toolbar icon!

03-11-2012, 06:59 PM	#12
Hitch Bookmaker & Cat Slave Posts: 11,503 Karma: 158448243 Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Phoenix, AZ Device: K2, iPad, KFire, PPW, Voyage, NookColor. 2 Droid, Oasis, Boox Note2	Must say... I only use BV to do a quick check on any fast stuff I've done in the last-minute tweaking...I never use it myself, I live in CV. With regard to Toxaris' suggestion vis-a-vis a styles dropdown, I don't see how that could work unless this gets turned into Jutoh; it already has header styles and "normal," and anything after that--at least for me--starts to require custom lists thereof, and can't really be applied in BV, anyway (unless we're going to apply "styles" like they do in Word or Jutoh...but that gets me back to "I hate that idea.") If we're going to have applicable styles (or coding with opening and closing tags of any kind, above and beyond what's already there), I'd just as soon have something more like NoteTab Pro's usage and less like Jutoh, FWIW; wherein we could create customized clips which apply the styles we create; dock the clips to the editor...now, that might be useful. Of course--again, I'm talking CV, not BV. Not sure that helps... Hitch

03-12-2012, 03:22 AM	#13
Toxaris Wizard Posts: 4,520 Karma: 121692313 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Heemskerk, NL Device: PRS-T1, Kobo Touch, Kobo Aura	I agree. I spent 95% of my time in CodeView. However, I can imagine people wanting to have that style dropbox. I personally would not care.

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03-13-2012, 10:27 AM	#14
Laurencej Junior Member Posts: 2 Karma: 10 Join Date: Dec 2011 Device: Kobo Touch	My vote: "use the CKE toolbar." And drop or hide the other.