Anti-Muslim Bias to the International Kindle

luqmaninbmore · 10-07-2009, 08:14 PM

Greetings All,

I'm not trying to sound paranoid or anything, but I did notice that one thing that seems to bind together many of the countries in which the international Kindle will not be sold is that they are Muslim countries. The only Muslim dominated countries that I could find that could receive the Kindle are Albania and Bosnia, which are within Europe, and Tanzania which is in eastern Africa. It is not available for sale within the entire Arab world, even in countries with well-developed infrastructure such as the United Arab Emirates. India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, and even Bhutan can receive it, but Pakistan and Bangladesh are excluded. Ethiopians can buy it, but their Muslim neighbours in Eritrea cannot. It is available in Russia and Mongolia, but not in the Central Asian Republics. It is available in Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos, but not Indonesia or Malaysia (to be fair, Thailand and Korea are excluded as well). I don't think this is due to potential censorship, given that it can be purchased in Myanmar, Bhutan (which has strict policies regarding external media), Russia, India, Sri Lanka, and Zimbabwe all of which have issues with censorship. Am I rushing to judgement? I find it hard to believe that Pakistani telecoms are harder to deal with than those in India or Sri Lanka, or that the infrastructure of Morocco is lagging behind that of Mongolia. What do you all think?

wallcraft · 10-07-2009, 08:34 PM

The AT&T coverage map includes some of the countries excluded from receiving a Kindle. So perhaps this is due to ebook rights. AT&T coverage is in Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia and UAE for example. AT&T isn't available in Pakistan (not even for their standard international data plans), which would otherwise presumably be a big market for English language ebooks.

desertgrandma · 10-07-2009, 08:34 PM

Its not available in Canada either, and yes, I believe you are most certainly rushing to judgment.

No company as huge as Amazon would be able to continue in business with that attitude.

DaleDe · 10-07-2009, 08:49 PM

They are prejudiced against Jews (not available in Israel), also against atheist (not available in communist china). I suspect there is another explanation than bias on their part. It is a serious accusation to jump without any data.

Superlucky · 10-07-2009, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luqmaninbmore

I'm not trying to sound paranoid or anything...

You sound paranoid.

Nate the great · 10-07-2009, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaleDe

They are prejudiced against Jews (not available in Israel), also against atheist (not available in communist china). I suspect there is another explanation than bias on their part. It is a serious accusation to jump without any data.

There is also a racial bias (it's not available in black).

brecklundin · 10-07-2009, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luqmaninbmore

Greetings All,

I'm not trying to sound paranoid or anything, but I did notice that one thing that seems to bind together many of the countries in which the international Kindle will not be sold is that they are Muslim countries. The only Muslim dominated countries that I could find that could receive the Kindle are Albania and Bosnia, which are within Europe, and Tanzania which is in eastern Africa. It is not available for sale within the entire Arab world, even in countries with well-developed infrastructure such as the United Arab Emirates. India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, and even Bhutan can receive it, but Pakistan and Bangladesh are excluded. Ethiopians can buy it, but their Muslim neighbours in Eritrea cannot. It is available in Russia and Mongolia, but not in the Central Asian Republics. It is available in Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos, but not Indonesia or Malaysia (to be fair, Thailand and Korea are excluded as well). I don't think this is due to potential censorship, given that it can be purchased in Myanmar, Bhutan (which has strict policies regarding external media), Russia, India, Sri Lanka, and Zimbabwe all of which have issues with censorship. Am I rushing to judgement? I find it hard to believe that Pakistani telecoms are harder to deal with than those in India or Sri Lanka, or that the infrastructure of Morocco is lagging behind that of Mongolia. What do you all think?

can we give negative karma???...jeebus tapdancing key-ryst...

luqmaninbmore · 10-07-2009, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

Its not available in Canada either, and yes, I believe you are most certainly rushing to judgment.

No company as huge as Amazon would be able to continue in business with that attitude.

I don't think it's because they dislike Muslims. It may because of fear of legal entaglements if someone objects to kindle content. This would not account for availability in Myanmar, Russia or other countries with censorship issues. I just find it hard to believe that telecom and ebook rights are easier to obtain in Zimbabwe than in Morocco, Algeria, Mauritania, or Tunisia.

Luqman

Sonist · 10-07-2009, 09:17 PM

Hmmmmm.....

It may also be, because they are preparing special editions of the Kindle for those countries, which will surreptitiously infect babies with AIDS and cause impotency in men....

It can't be anything else.... Hmmmm....

P.S. Just saw your post above. You may have kind of a point regarding the more orthodox Muslim countries (god forbid someone downloads The Satanic Verses from Amazon,) but I would still guess it may have to do more with publishing rights and restrictions.

Alfy · 10-07-2009, 10:11 PM

Considering the censorship in countries like Saudi Arabia, it's no wonder: the process of selling a single book would be a nightmare. And guess what? That's true in China as well!

whitearrow · 10-08-2009, 01:09 AM

::: eyeroll :::

I'll take paranoid, knee-jerk anti-Americanism for $200, Alex.

Kali Yuga · 10-08-2009, 02:35 AM

Is Amazon anti-Muslim? I'm gonna say "no."

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss?ur...=koran&x=0&y=0

Most likely the hold-up linked to an international book rights issue. Besides, this is just the launch, I'm sure service will be expanded to more countries.

HansTWN · 10-08-2009, 03:12 AM

I am sure Amazon would gladly take any Muslim's money, if they could!

braver · 10-08-2009, 03:15 AM

Russia has no real censorship for books or electronic media -- it's for movies, TV, large circulation print, and other mass media only, so it's not surprising the Kindle is available there now. iPhone was available in Russia for a while officially. Russian cell phone companies also are mostly partners with the European ones and data roaming is easy. One shouldn't mix Chinese or Saudi issues with the Russian ones -- no Internet censorship whatsoever so far.

AlexBell · 10-08-2009, 04:54 AM

I find many of the responses in this thread quite discomforting.

The thread was started by someone checking out an opinion, and giving detailed reasons for his or her concerns. Whether or not the concerns are justified is not the point; the point is that many of the responses read as though the respondent felt personally insulted, and in my opinion at least are disproportionate to the objective way the original post was worded.

For example
'It is a serious accusation to jump without any data.'

'You sound paranoid'

'can we give negative karma???...jeebus tapdancing key-ryst... '

'It may also be, because they are preparing special editions of the Kindle for those countries, which will surreptitiously infect babies with AIDS and cause impotency in men....'

'I'll take paranoid, knee-jerk anti-Americanism for $200, Alex.'

Guilty consciences, anyone?

Regards, Alex

10-07-2009, 08:14 PM	#1
luqmaninbmore Da'i Posts: 1,144 Karma: 1217499 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Baltimore Device: Toshiba Thrive, Kobo Touch, Kindle 1, Aluratek Libre, T-Mobile Comet	Anti-Muslim Bias to the International Kindle? Greetings All, I'm not trying to sound paranoid or anything, but I did notice that one thing that seems to bind together many of the countries in which the international Kindle will not be sold is that they are Muslim countries. The only Muslim dominated countries that I could find that could receive the Kindle are Albania and Bosnia, which are within Europe, and Tanzania which is in eastern Africa. It is not available for sale within the entire Arab world, even in countries with well-developed infrastructure such as the United Arab Emirates. India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, and even Bhutan can receive it, but Pakistan and Bangladesh are excluded. Ethiopians can buy it, but their Muslim neighbours in Eritrea cannot. It is available in Russia and Mongolia, but not in the Central Asian Republics. It is available in Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos, but not Indonesia or Malaysia (to be fair, Thailand and Korea are excluded as well). I don't think this is due to potential censorship, given that it can be purchased in Myanmar, Bhutan (which has strict policies regarding external media), Russia, India, Sri Lanka, and Zimbabwe all of which have issues with censorship. Am I rushing to judgement? I find it hard to believe that Pakistani telecoms are harder to deal with than those in India or Sri Lanka, or that the infrastructure of Morocco is lagging behind that of Mongolia. What do you all think? Last edited by luqmaninbmore; 10-08-2009 at 10:11 AM. Reason: Added question mark to indicate that this is a question, not a conclusion.

10-07-2009, 09:17 PM	#9
Sonist Apeist Posts: 2,126 Karma: 381090 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: The sunny part of California Device: Generic virtual reality story-experiential device	Hmmmmm..... It may also be, because they are preparing special editions of the Kindle for those countries, which will surreptitiously infect babies with AIDS and cause impotency in men.... It can't be anything else.... Hmmmm.... P.S. Just saw your post above. You may have kind of a point regarding the more orthodox Muslim countries (god forbid someone downloads The Satanic Verses from Amazon,) but I would still guess it may have to do more with publishing rights and restrictions. Last edited by Sonist; 10-07-2009 at 09:23 PM.

10-08-2009, 03:15 AM	#14
braver Enthusiast Posts: 49 Karma: 86 Join Date: Sep 2009 Device: Amazon Kindle DX	Russia has no real censorship for books or electronic media -- it's for movies, TV, large circulation print, and other mass media only, so it's not surprising the Kindle is available there now. iPhone was available in Russia for a while officially. Russian cell phone companies also are mostly partners with the European ones and data roaming is easy. One shouldn't mix Chinese or Saudi issues with the Russian ones -- no Internet censorship whatsoever so far. Last edited by braver; 10-08-2009 at 03:18 AM.

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10-07-2009, 08:34 PM	#2
wallcraft reader Posts: 6,975 Karma: 5183568 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mississippi, USA Device: Kindle 3, Kobo Glo HD	The AT&T coverage map includes some of the countries excluded from receiving a Kindle. So perhaps this is due to ebook rights. AT&T coverage is in Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia and UAE for example. AT&T isn't available in Pakistan (not even for their standard international data plans), which would otherwise presumably be a big market for English language ebooks.

10-07-2009, 08:34 PM	#3
desertgrandma Enjoying the show.... Posts: 14,270 Karma: 10462843 Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Arizona Device: A K1, Kindle Paperwhite, an Ipod, IPad2, Iphone, an Ipad Mini & macAir	Its not available in Canada either, and yes, I believe you are most certainly rushing to judgment. No company as huge as Amazon would be able to continue in business with that attitude.

10-07-2009, 08:49 PM	#4
DaleDe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 11,470 Karma: 13095790 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Grass Valley, CA Device: EB 1150, EZ Reader, Literati, iPad 2 & Air 2, iPhone 7	They are prejudiced against Jews (not available in Israel), also against atheist (not available in communist china). I suspect there is another explanation than bias on their part. It is a serious accusation to jump without any data.

10-07-2009, 10:11 PM	#10
Alfy Liseur de Bonne Aventure Posts: 374 Karma: 2176666 Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Paris, France Device: PRS T1	Considering the censorship in countries like Saudi Arabia, it's no wonder: the process of selling a single book would be a nightmare. And guess what? That's true in China as well!

10-08-2009, 01:09 AM	#11
whitearrow Guru Posts: 808 Karma: 2260766 Join Date: Apr 2008 Device: Kindle Oasis 2	::: eyeroll ::: I'll take paranoid, knee-jerk anti-Americanism for $200, Alex.

10-08-2009, 02:35 AM	#12
Kali Yuga Professional Contrarian Posts: 2,045 Karma: 3289631 Join Date: Mar 2009 Device: Kindle 4 No Touchie	Is Amazon anti-Muslim? I'm gonna say "no." http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss?ur...=koran&x=0&y=0 Most likely the hold-up linked to an international book rights issue. Besides, this is just the launch, I'm sure service will be expanded to more countries.

10-08-2009, 03:12 AM	#13
HansTWN Wizard Posts: 4,538 Karma: 264065402 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Taiwan Device: HP Touchpad, Sony Duo 13, Lumia 920, Kobo Aura HD	I am sure Amazon would gladly take any Muslim's money, if they could!

10-08-2009, 04:54 AM	#15
AlexBell Wizard Posts: 3,413 Karma: 13369310 Join Date: May 2008 Location: Launceston, Tasmania Device: Sony PRS T3, Kobo Glo, Kindle Touch, iPad, Samsung SB 2 tablet	I find many of the responses in this thread quite discomforting. The thread was started by someone checking out an opinion, and giving detailed reasons for his or her concerns. Whether or not the concerns are justified is not the point; the point is that many of the responses read as though the respondent felt personally insulted, and in my opinion at least are disproportionate to the objective way the original post was worded. For example 'It is a serious accusation to jump without any data.' 'You sound paranoid' 'can we give negative karma???...jeebus tapdancing key-ryst... ' 'It may also be, because they are preparing special editions of the Kindle for those countries, which will surreptitiously infect babies with AIDS and cause impotency in men....' 'I'll take paranoid, knee-jerk anti-Americanism for $200, Alex.' Guilty consciences, anyone? Regards, Alex

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