Brian Keene on piracy

[no.guru]

Originally Posted by anamardoll

Yeah, see, this is my thing. ...

Spot-on. If there was a violation and he was so worried about it, he would pursue legal actions against those responsible.

[elcreative]

Originally Posted by no.guru

Spot-on. If there was a violation and he was so worried about it, he would pursue legal actions against those responsible.

Yeah, just like all those filthy rich authors, spend all the money they don't necessarily have on lawyers... good idea, this guy isn't a Stephen King or a J K Rowling...

[no.guru]

Originally Posted by elcreative

Yeah, just like all those filthy rich authors, spend all the money they don't necessarily have on lawyers... good idea, this guy isn't a Stephen King or a J K Rowling...

No kidding. Never heard of him before this thread, but it's currently a page 3 google hit on his name. It's also free.

[anamardoll]

Originally Posted by no.guru

Spot-on. If there was a violation and he was so worried about it, he would pursue legal actions against those responsible.

Well, I mean, I'm not even willing to go that far. Lawyers are expensive and this sort of thing is a bottomless pit. I wouldn't sue.

I can see complaining if it was like "guys, please stop circulating it for free when I'm trying to make a living selling it for $4.99 on the site. That's the cost of a Subway sandwich, please, c'mon." Like, THAT, I'm like, okay, author-guy, that sounds reasonable.

But "guys, please stop circulating it for free when there are $50 copies to buy". No. Seriously? Who are you? I wouldn't pay $50 for a signed anything unless it was from Douglas Adams and it was a posthumous signature.

Limited editions don't benefit the author, they benefit eBay. And everyone else loses, and your audience gets to feel like you don't care about them unless they're the 1% of people who can drop $50 on a single book on a whim. Bah.

Again: Wouldn't download his books, but I reserve the right to think he's a whelk.

[HansTWN]

Originally Posted by anamardoll

Well, I mean, I'm not even willing to go that far. Lawyers are expensive and this sort of thing is a bottomless pit. I wouldn't sue.

I can see complaining if it was like "guys, please stop circulating it for free when I'm trying to make a living selling it for $4.99 on the site. That's the cost of a Subway sandwich, please, c'mon." Like, THAT, I'm like, okay, author-guy, that sounds reasonable.

But "guys, please stop circulating it for free when there are $50 copies to buy". No. Seriously? Who are you? I wouldn't pay $50 for a signed anything unless it was from Douglas Adams and it was a posthumous signature.

Limited editions don't benefit the author, they benefit eBay. And everyone else loses, and your audience gets to feel like you don't care about them unless they're the 1% of people who can drop $50 on a single book on a whim. Bah.

Again: Wouldn't download his books, but I reserve the right to think he's a whelk.

It may very well be a really dumb move by the author (those limited editions), but it is his decision and others should respect it. He is allowed to make his own mistakes.

[Giggleton]

Originally Posted by HansTWN

Just illustrate the point that early copyright had absolute nothing to do with the public --- it was to limit competition between sellers, sort of like a patent.

Now these days, when everybody has their own "electronic printing machine", we obviously need stronger protection.

If you think that the purpose of the internet is to sell books then perhaps you are right, if you think that the purpose of the internet is to advance our understanding of the human condition then perhaps you are wrong.

Who are you protecting your books from? People who want to read what you write?

[HansTWN]

Originally Posted by Giggleton

If you think that the purpose of the internet is to sell books then perhaps you are right, if you think that the purpose of the internet is to advance our understanding of the human condition then perhaps you are wrong.

Who are you protecting your books from? People who want to read what you write?

First, I don't write books. I do, however, believe in protecting the rights of those who provide me with reading pleasure over the perceived rights of those who just want a free ride.

The current system works quite well, those who want to save money or cannot afford to buy the books still have legal options like the library, or borrowing a pbook from a friend. I don't see how your "understanding the human condition" is negatively affected when you have to help the author put a little food on the table rather? Unless everything else is free, too, products in digital form cannot be free (except when the creator explicitly allows free copying).

And seriously, most books will offer little help in understanding the human condition -- they are just entertainment. And most of those that actually do are in PD already.

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by elcreative

Yeah, just like all those filthy rich authors, spend all the money they don't necessarily have on lawyers... good idea, this guy isn't a Stephen King or a J K Rowling...

If he didn't artificially restrict his audience to the very rich, maybe he would make a lot more money. So much more, in fact, that he wouldn't need to worry about piracy.

[elcreative]

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

If he didn't artificially restrict his audience to the very rich, maybe he would make a lot more money. So much more, in fact, that he wouldn't need to worry about piracy.

So just because you aren't a collector then nobody else is allowed to be... lovely attitude and too typical of a certain section of contributors on this forum... commonly known as "dog in the manger" or "if I can't have it/don't want it then no-one else can or should be allowed to..."

If you're so desperate for a "collectible" then pay the price, if you're not (and/or consider the price outrageous" then don't buy, get something else but for crying out aloud - STOP whinging about authors' rights to supply customers with what they want, collectibles and then meet a more general market as something you consider more suitably priced/produced to meet your needs... it's their right to do this, they created the work...

And as an aside... limited editions produce a nice bonus income for an author and do NOT affect mass market sales as most readers never come across the limited edition or just ignore it...

[Hatgirl]

Originally Posted by anamardoll

Again: Wouldn't download his books, but I reserve the right to think he's a whelk.

I want this on a T-shirt

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by elcreative

So just because you aren't a collector then nobody else is allowed to be... lovely attitude and too typical of a certain section of contributors on this forum... commonly known as "dog in the manger" or "if I can't have it/don't want it then no-one else can or should be allowed to..."

If you're so desperate for a "collectible" then pay the price, if you're not (and/or consider the price outrageous" then don't buy, get something else but for crying out aloud - STOP whinging about authors' rights to supply customers with what they want, collectibles and then meet a more general market as something you consider more suitably priced/produced to meet your needs... it's their right to do this, they created the work...

And as an aside... limited editions produce a nice bonus income for an author and do NOT affect mass market sales as most readers never come across the limited edition or just ignore it...

$50 x 500 copies = $25,000, of which the writer will only get 25%. They won't get anything from the $100+ prices readers will need to pay on Ebay/Amazon because all the preorders went to dealers.

An ebook and/or mass market edition alongside the speculator edition would keep everyone happy. The only reason I can think of not to do that would be to force people who can't really afford it to buy the speculator edition. Not the best way to treat your fans, if you ask me. And certainly not the best way to minimise piracy.

[no.guru]

Just to clarify: I believe creators have every right to sell their creations and put any price on them. The old publishing business model is dead, however.

A new business model is emerging and Keene is apparently turning his back on it. It won't help his sales and it won't delay the tide for a second.

My interest in him is higher now, because I want to see the shocked tantrum he throws when his limited edition ends up online.

[elcreative]

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

$50 x 500 copies = $25,000, of which the writer will only get 25%. They won't get anything from the $100+ prices readers will need to pay on Ebay/Amazon because all the preorders went to dealers.

An ebook and/or mass market edition alongside the speculator edition would keep everyone happy. The only reason I can think of not to do that would be to force people who can't really afford it to buy the speculator edition. Not the best way to treat your fans, if you ask me. And certainly not the best way to minimise piracy.

And the author payment percentages are usually higher on limited editions... just making up figures doesn't prove anything... and stop calling them speculator editions, few of the entire run end up on eBay, the majority end up with the people they're aimed at - COLLECTORS - but of course you are another of the, "if I don't want it/won't pay the asking price for it" brigade that seems to think that those who do want it shouldn't have their requirements met before yours as your needs are greater... most art forms have put out limited editions before doing mass-market versions because there is a demand for them...

[anamardoll]

Originally Posted by no.guru

My interest in him is higher now, because I want to see the shocked tantrum he throws when his limited edition ends up online.

BY A FAN, NO LESS!! THE HUMANITY.

Books should just self-destruct after the first reading. It's the only way to be fair.

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by elcreative

And the author payment percentages are usually higher on limited editions... just making up figures doesn't prove anything... and stop calling them speculator editions, few of the entire run end up on eBay, the majority end up with the people they're aimed at - COLLECTORS - but of course you are another of the, "if I don't want it/won't pay the asking price for it" brigade that seems to think that those who do want it shouldn't have their requirements met before yours as your needs are greater... most art forms have put out limited editions before doing mass-market versions because there is a demand for them...

It's still only a maximum of 500 x whatever his percentage is. But I doubt it will be much more than 25%, if that. Mass market is only 20%, and if there's an agent involved they will want their cut of that as well.

And if most of them don't go to dealers, why are Ebay and Amazon always flooded with them on release day?