03-12-2009, 02:01 PM | #76 | |
Holy S**T!!!
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Quote:
And, what Amazon is doing is controlling where books read on the Kindle are purchased ... not published ... purchased. Amazon is telling me, the user, that I may NOT purchase books from other vendors. Amazon is telling me, the user, that I am limited to viewing materials on my Kindle that Amazon sells. I am certain they would limit my access to public domain materials if they could. It also concerns me that Amazon retains the right to monitor what materials are on my Kindle. Which include (but not for long) personal and client materials for review. I fail to see why Alex should be required to take on Amazon in a legal battle over the damage that Amazon is doing to the rights of American citizens. He doesn't live in the States and his business is not located there. I simply find it incredibly sad that most people, such as yourself, do not understand the distinction between copyright law and the DMCA. They are two different animals altogether, and the latter is a poor attempt to drag the former into the digital age. |
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03-12-2009, 02:04 PM | #77 | |
Banned
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Quote:
Maybe you want to look up hypocrisy? |
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03-12-2009, 02:06 PM | #78 |
Fully Converged
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Fine, you don't want to. Bye then.
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03-12-2009, 02:06 PM | #79 |
Wizard
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Not to mention mis-informed. He seems to have some significant confusion over the relationship between public domain and copyright law as well as the DMCA.
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03-12-2009, 02:07 PM | #80 |
Publishers are evil!
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Scotty,
Why exactly is software that discovers the Kindle's PID a violation of DMCA? Using the software to get the PID allows Kindle owners to purchase books from retailers other than Amazon and to also use their Kindle for reading electronic library books. Your assertion that this is somehow illegal seems like an overreaching on your part. Did you contact Amazon and make the assertion that Mobileread was somehow violating Amazon's rights? I've noticed that you seem to be the only one here that takes the position that determing the Kindle PID is illegal and tantamount to starving babies or some such nonsense. I tell you, it's too bad you can't give negative Karma (I tried). |
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03-12-2009, 02:29 PM | #81 |
Uebermensch
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03-12-2009, 02:35 PM | #82 | |
Member
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Quote:
So feel free to bring your Kindle with whatever reading materials you prefer on your europe trip. |
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03-12-2009, 02:50 PM | #83 |
Gizmologist
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Folks, there's no point in addressing any further remarks to Scotty1024, he's no longer in a position to respond in this forum.
Please resume your previous discussion(s), or not, as you prefer. |
03-12-2009, 02:58 PM | #84 |
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Legally Speaking
Ahhh. The power of moderation.
This will run a little long I think, and since Scotty appears to be banned it may even be preaching to the choir, but I think it was Scotty who fails to understand the DRM and the DMCA. The Copyright Act contains exceptions which can be found in Sections 107-122 and is where you will find the references to fair use. There are also exceptions to the DMCA that are not specifically enumerated in statute. As is common here in the US, the courts have taken to interpretation of the DMCA and the scope its provisions should have. In 2004, in Chamberlain v. Skylink, the 7th Circuit upheld a lower court ruling that the DMCA did not apply to garage door openers. See Chamberlain Group, Inc. v. Skylink Techs., Inc., 292 F. Supp. 2d 1040 (N.D. Ill 2003); aff’d, 381 F.3d 1178 (Fed Cir. 2004). The federal court held that: “The DMCA does not create a new property right for copyright owners. Nor, for that matter, does it divest the public of the property rights that the Copyright Act has long granted to the public. The anti-circumvention and anti-trafficking provisions of the DMCA create new grounds of liability. A copyright owner seeking to impose liability on an accused circumventor must demonstrate a reasonable relationship between the circumvention at issue and a use relating to a property right for which the Copyright Act permits the copyright owner to withhold authorization-as well as notice that authorization was withheld.” This was reasserted in Storage Technology Corp. v. Custom Hardware Engineering & Consulting, 421 F.3d 1307 (Fed Cir. 2005), where the court held that circumvention must be related to a protectible copyright interest Under this case, the court held that "A copyright owner alleging a violation of section 1201(a) consequently must prove that the circumvention of the technological measure either 'infringes or facilitates infringing a right protected by the Copyright Act.'" Because the Court held that Custom Hardware's activities were not an infringement of copyright based on an exception for computer programs in Section 117 of the Copyright Act, the DMCA claim thereby failed. This suggests that if a technological control were circumvented for a noninfringing personal or fair use, the DMCA circumvention could be permissible. The court went on to say that "The activation of the maintenance code may violate StorageTek's contractual rights vis-a-vis its customers, but those rights are not the rights protected by copyright law." This doesn't protect someone for a contractual suit based on violation of the TOS, but it would preclude the use of the breach of the TOS as a basis for a DMCA violation. None of this really gives any finality to the ultimate question here because there still exists a valid decision in Universal City Studios, Inc. v. Reimerdes, 111 F.Supp.2d 294 (S.D.N.Y. 2000); Universal City Studios, Inc. v. Corley, 273 F.3d 429 (2d Cir. 2001), which is the now original test of the DMCA where the defendant was enjoined from posting a link to DeCSS which stripped DVD's of their copy protection allowing personal/fair use. Because there is some question as to what the current law really means, I can understand Mobileread's decision not to fight the takedown notice. Let someone with deeper pockets fight the battle. For what it is worth, the Feds are in the process of conducting the rulemaking proceedings required under DMCA called the Rulemaking on Exemptions from Prohibition on Circumvention of Technological Measures that Control Access to Copyrighted Works. The public hearings on the requested additions to the enumerated exemptions are to be held as follows: Palo Alto, California on Friday, May 1, 2009, at 9:00 a.m. Washington, DC on Wednesday, May 6, 2009, Thursday, May 7, 2009, and Friday, May 8, 2009, at 10:00 a.m. Requests to testify must be received by 5:00 p.m. E.D.T. on Friday, April 3, 2009. If you are interested in what exemptions are being considered you can read the requests at http://www.copyright.gov/1201/. |
03-12-2009, 03:04 PM | #85 |
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Um ... thanks for that, I think, legaleagll.
Could you maybe boil it down into plain English for those of us (like me) not fluent in legalese? |
03-12-2009, 03:23 PM | #86 | |
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Quote:
The reason I say it isn't settled is because what happens if the circumvention facilitates both a use that qualifies for an exemption (personal copy) and one that doesn't (pirating). Which is the use that is used to determine the violation of the DMCA? I have my personal opinion as to how this should come out, which is as long as there is a legitimate exemption use for the circumvention then the public policy mandate that created that exemption should outweigh the potential illegal use. I'm not sure that this was any clearer, but I tried. |
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03-12-2009, 03:27 PM | #87 |
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Thanks, it seemed clearer, at any rate.
But to sum up, if something like, say ... a piece of code allowed you to read a number off of a piece of hardware, which then allowed you to read a DRMed file on that piece of hardware without removing the DRM in question, then it would probably be the first category you mentioned. But if you could then use that number, along with some totally other piece of code to remove the DRM that would put the first piece of code (the second being clearly "of the Dark Side") in the second category, and therefore in the, as yet, untested gray area. Do I seem to be following you? |
03-12-2009, 03:27 PM | #88 |
books & doughnuts
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g/f gave me one a k2, nice unit, not ugly, i've been on their forums, that's where i found out about this kindlepid, i wish i did program, sounds great, why does mobile read have to get rid of the stuff and amazon's blogs can keep their references to it, are they the only ones that can talk about the kindle?
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03-12-2009, 03:32 PM | #89 |
Gizmologist
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Excellent question, UncleDuke. I s'pose it's possible that they're simply distracted by policing others and haven't noticed what's going on in their own back yard.
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03-12-2009, 03:40 PM | #90 |
Hi There!
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Now that they are trapping all of the Kindlers in their inescapable web, how long do you suppose it will take them to jack up the prices of Kindle books? After all, they can charge whatever they like to pull teeth, seeing as how they are the only dentists in town.
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