Help: missing embedded fonts after ePub3 transfer to Kindle

[LostOnTheLine]

Originally Posted by Quoth

That's a really old idea that predates ebooks and is BROKEN. The author needs to properly do dialogue with speech or action tags.

When there's dialogue the dialogue is formatted properly as dialogue, but these aren't those instances. The series is set like a family telling the tales of their epic adventures. The first few are just with the same narrator but eventually he marries & has kids & other people join them. The voice of each narrator is different & reflects their personality. It's not a 3rd person perspective where you can be inside different people's heads, each narrator narrates in 1st person. Which you'd think would be juxtaposed & unpleasant but it is done very well & actually enriches the story. Some of the characters English is not their 1st language & the author does a great job of making the way their think & write sound (at least to someone who doesn't speak the languages) like a foreigner. & I'd guess that translated versions would have a similar "Native" sound to the English characters & foreign sound to the others.

So while I understand what you are saying, & agree that there are definitely instances where what you say makes sense, In this instance I think you are completely wrong.

Originally Posted by Quoth

Depends whose old tales you read. Elves & Dwarves were also correct and older. See hoof > hooves. And borders elves (Scotland / England) in Thomas the Rhymer are like the Irish Sidhe (Scots sith or sìde) and those are much like Tolkien's Elves. He really only invented the Hobbits. The publisher's proof reader must have been uneducated.
Fairies (elves) being small & winged started in England with Shakespeare and peaked in Victoria Era and Early 20th C. The older stories are quite different.

I was quoting the Author's reason for spelling them differently than the, at the time, accepted "correct" way. He said that they were both usually associated with "Silly tales" & that wasn't the characters he wanted.
As far as Faeries being the same as elves... That's a stretch. But they do have similar & common origins but this isn't the place for that discussion. But Dwarves from my understanding of the lore, which comes mostly from Wales, Scottland, England, & Norse, are much more similar to how gnomes are portrayed modernly & completely dissimilar to how Tolkien wrote them. The only thing that comes even close to Tolkienian Dwarves would be the 4 who hold up the sky, but I can't really say that's because of how they were written & not because when I read about them I assumed things because they were called Dwarfs.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by LostOnTheLine

When there's dialogue the dialogue is formatted properly as dialogue, but these aren't those instances. The series is set like a family telling the tales of their epic adventures. The first few are just with the same narrator but eventually he marries & has kids & other people join them. The voice of each narrator is different & reflects their personality. It's not a 3rd person perspective where you can be inside different people's heads, each narrator narrates in 1st person. Which you'd think would be juxtaposed & unpleasant but it is done very well & actually enriches the story. Some of the characters English is not their 1st language & the author does a great job of making the way their think & write sound (at least to someone who doesn't speak the languages) like a foreigner. & I'd guess that translated versions would have a similar "Native" sound to the English characters & foreign sound to the others.

So while I understand what you are saying, & agree that there are definitely instances where what you say makes sense, In this instance I think you are completely wrong.



I was quoting the Author's reason for spelling them differently than the, at the time, accepted "correct" way. He said that they were both usually associated with "Silly tales" & that wasn't the characters he wanted.
As far as Faeries being the same as elves... That's a stretch. But they do have similar & common origins but this isn't the place for that discussion. But Dwarves from my understanding of the lore, which comes mostly from Wales, Scottland, England, & Norse, are much more similar to how gnomes are portrayed modernly & completely dissimilar to how Tolkien wrote them. The only thing that comes even close to Tolkienian Dwarves would be the 4 who hold up the sky, but I can't really say that's because of how they were written & not because when I read about them I assumed things because they were called Dwarfs.

May I ask-what's the name of this book with all the various personae appearing in different fonts????

Hitch

[Turtle91]

Yes, please! I’d like to see that as well.

I’m currently reading an ebook where the author uses font color in a similar fashion. Is it absolutely essential? No. But it definitely adds flavor to the story.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by LostOnTheLine

I haven't finished reading this thread yet but I keep hearing this same sentiment over & over again & it's annoying.

The reason I suggested removing the fonts is because most eBooks don't need the embedded fonts they have.

Now lets see if your problem can be solved. How are you converting this ePub3 to read on your Kindle? if you are converting to Mobi then the fonts will be stripped as Mobi does not support embedded fonts. You need to convert to Kf8 (AZW3).

Use calibre to do the conversion. Do not use send-to-Kindle. Now, once you've gotten the eBook on your Kindle and you've opened it, go to the Aa menu and select Publisher Font.

That should do it.

[nabsltd]

Originally Posted by Quoth

That's a really old idea that predates ebooks and is BROKEN. The author needs to properly do dialogue with speech or action tags. However if you are converting someone else's work you are stuck with it.

And, this will likely break on a Kindle, although maybe only for KFX.

I tested ePub to KFX conversion, and if an HTML page has more than 50% of the "normal reading" paragraphs set to a embedded font, it will not display correctly. Instead, the font the person chooses as their reading font in the Kindle software (Bookerly, Amazon Ember, user-installed, etc.) will be used.

I have not tested what happens if two or more embedded fonts make up more than 50% of the "normal reading" paragraphs in a single HTML page.

[Quoth]

Ah, that would be why if you have too many body fonts embedded on KDP upload that Amazon strips them. Not sure if "send to kindle" does the same, but likely it does.

Anyone know what the limit is?

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by LostOnTheLine

I was quoting the Author's reason for spelling them differently than the, at the time, accepted "correct" way. He said that they were both usually associated with "Silly tales" & that wasn't the characters he wanted.
As far as Faeries being the same as elves... That's a stretch. But they do have similar & common origins but this isn't the place for that discussion. But Dwarves from my understanding of the lore, which comes mostly from Wales, Scottland, England, & Norse, are much more similar to how gnomes are portrayed modernly & completely dissimilar to how Tolkien wrote them. The only thing that comes even close to Tolkienian Dwarves would be the 4 who hold up the sky, but I can't really say that's because of how they were written & not because when I read about them I assumed things because they were called Dwarfs.

I'm familiar with Tolkien's writing on why he did what he did. Elves mostly are unrelated to Celtic Sidhe (shee) and continental and there a kind of dwarf called an elf in Europe mainland. I was suggesting that Tolkien because of wanting to recreate "lost" legends (See Beowulf) he picked the oldest kind of Fay (Sidhe) called Elves in later stories in boarder of Scotland and England like in "Thomas the Rhymer" and another one I forget. They are not the little people of later stories.

Norse tradition has light elves (maybe small and associated with flowers), murky elves and dark elves (seem like dwarves), all of which may be different sorts of dwarves. Some tales do have dwarves like Tolkien's ones. See making and giving of the Brísingamen.

Gnomes and Trolls are also imported to English from the continent and Scandinavia. That's the origin of the actually not really Irish at all Leprechaun. Those are really late stories.

I agree that with how the author has conceived the story the different fonts are needed. It's a valid opinion held by many writers over the last 100+ years that such an typological artefact is stupid.
Blind, partially sighted, dyslectic people?
Audio books & radio drama?
I've attempted to read such a book and it was cute but I couldn't finish it. Too exhausting to read.
Also many reading platforms (many Android apps) will not support such formatting.
Kindle Publishing of ebooks has about 92% of the English Language market and it won't support it.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Quoth

I agree that with how the author has conceived the story the different fonts are needed. It's a valid opinion held by many writers over the last 100+ years that such an typological artefact is stupid.
Blind, partially sighted, dyslectic people?
Audio books & radio drama?
I've attempted to read such a book and it was cute but I couldn't finish it. Too exhausting to read.
Also many reading platforms (many Android apps) will not support such formatting.
Kindle Publishing of ebooks has about 92% of the English Language market and it won't support it.

And if you have an old Kindle, K2, Kindle DX/DXG, you are stuck with Mobi and no embedded fonts so this eBook won't work.

[Turtle91]

It also might be difficult if you are using a chisel and stone…

[Quoth]

You can have any font you want on a stone (it's just slow), though soft clay was more popular. Stone was more for buildings, boundaries, tombs/memorials and outdoor structures than ordinary reading.

[LostOnTheLine]

Originally Posted by Hitch

May I ask-what's the name of this book with all the various personae appearing in different fonts????

Hitch

I've seen it a couple times, but the series that I was referring to has religious connotations & I learned the hard way not to even offhandedly mention things of that nature in places like this because there's always going to be somebody who either sees it as a problem or can't let go of the idea because you said it.
Like once someone was talking about how awful Islam was & quoted a bunch of things from the Quran. Some of the things she said went against what little bit I know of Islam so I looked up the quotes & found that in context they all had completely different meanings than the way she was using them.
So I commented about what those passages actually meant, I don't remember all of them but an example I do remember was something that, out of context, made it sound like "women are property" but in context it was telling men that it was their duty to protect their women & was essentially saying "You'd do all this to protect your property, your women (wives, daughters, sisters) are your most valuable property & you need to do more to protect them"
But someone who was agreeing with her followed me around & commented on just about every post I made that I am Islamic & couldn't be trusted. Even though On her comment I had relied & explained that I wasn't & that I just looked up the things the OP quoted to find their context.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The reason I suggested removing the fonts is because most eBooks don't need the embedded fonts they have.

That's fair, most of the time I think it definitely isn't necessary, but font files are small so having a couple in a book, even if just for things like titles, seems reasonable to me.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Now lets see if your problem can be solved. How are you converting this ePub3 to read on your Kindle? if you are converting to Mobi then the fonts will be stripped as Mobi does not support embedded fonts. You need to convert to Kf8 (AZW3).

Use calibre to do the conversion. Do not use send-to-Kindle. Now, once you've gotten the eBook on your Kindle and you've opened it, go to the Aa menu and select Publisher Font.

That should do it.

So, as I said, I don't have eBook versions of these books, I read them in Paperback years ago. I'm not even sure they exist in eBook format.

Originally Posted by Quoth

Elves mostly are unrelated to Celtic Sidhe (shee) and continental and there a kind of dwarf called an elf in Europe mainland. I was suggesting that Tolkien because of wanting to recreate "lost" legends (See Beowulf) he picked the oldest kind of Fay (Sidhe) called Elves in later stories in boarder of Scotland and England like in "Thomas the Rhymer" and another one I forget. They are not the little people of later stories.

I mean it's been awhile, but I studied European Fae lore once upon a time but the Sidhe were little people. You could argue that they were more like Hobbits, as in The Hobbit Bilbo's house is pretty much inside a Sidhe (the terms Sidhe is short for "People of the Mounds" & the mounds themselves were Sidhe which means "Mounds of dirt". The Irish or Scottish, whichever I don't remember & it's not important, Believed that magical beings lived in these dirt mounds & liked sweets... The size of the mounds are not very large, they're like the size of a person tall, so I don't remember if they are specifically sited as being small, but they would have to be to live in a house that a human would have to break to stand up in...

Originally Posted by Quoth

Norse tradition has light elves (maybe small and associated with flowers), murky elves and dark elves (seem like dwarves), all of which may be different sorts of dwarves. Some tales do have dwarves like Tolkien's ones. See making and giving of the Brísingamen.

So this story is one that is one of the "Changed in the name of Christianity" stories that we don't even know what the original story was. The Catholic church sought out & destroyed a lot of Fae Lore & replaced a lot with Christian-ized versions of them.
Interesting off-topic comment: the pointed ears of Fae creatures were originally "leaf-shaped" & it is debated, but more accepted than not, that the leaf-shaped attribute was added by the Catholic church because it was a symbol of deformity that was associated with cursed, demonic, & evil beings.

Originally Posted by Quoth

I agree that with how the author has conceived the story the different fonts are needed. It's a valid opinion held by many writers over the last 100+ years that such an typological artefact is stupid.
Blind, partially sighted, dyslectic people?
Audio books & radio drama?

For the use case I was referencing Audio Books wouldn't be a problem because you'd just have a different reader for the different Narrator/Font.
As for Special Needs Cases... In a lot of ways those are made specially for those who need them. Like a Large-Print book, by that logic all physical books should be large print... You're going to loose nuances when you change the media for a special audience, that's just a fact. Like a translation can never have the same nuances as the original, no matter how good the translator is. But they can do their best to be as close as possible. As for Dyslexic... They wouldn't see it because they'd be using the dyslexic font on a Kindle. Are they loosing something? Yes. But does that mean everybody should loose it because they are? I don't think so

[theducks]

Voices: Colors do not work on my e-ink (my primary way of reading).

I have been listening to an Audiobook as I hike to the Bus stop. It amazes me, the number of voices that THE ONE Narrator does. (Rich Little?)

Different voices is also why I like Voice Actors vs TTS (and they drop 'he/she said", the firs clue a YouTuber is using TTS)

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by LostOnTheLine

I've seen it a couple times, but the series that I was referring to has religious connotations & I learned the hard way not to even offhandedly mention things of that nature in places like this because there's always going to be somebody who either sees it as a problem or can't let go of the idea because you said it.

So, that's a no, then?

Like once someone was talking about how awful Islam was & quoted a bunch of things from the Quran. Some of the things she said went against what little bit I know of Islam so I looked up the quotes & found that in context they all had completely different meanings than the way she was using them.
So I commented about what those passages actually meant, I don't remember all of them but an example I do remember was something that, out of context, made it sound like "women are property" but in context it was telling men that it was their duty to protect their women & was essentially saying "You'd do all this to protect your property, your women (wives, daughters, sisters) are your most valuable property & you need to do more to protect them"
But someone who was agreeing with her followed me around & commented on just about every post I made that I am Islamic & couldn't be trusted. Even though On her comment I had relied & explained that I wasn't & that I just looked up the things the OP quoted to find their context.

I'm pretty sure I was talking fonts, but...hey.

That's fair, most of the time I think it definitely isn't necessary, but font files are small so having a couple in a book, even if just for things like titles, seems reasonable to me.

Unhunh. They're not that small once they start procreating.

So, as I said, I don't have eBook versions of these books, I read them in Paperback years ago. I'm not even sure they exist in eBook format.

Well, heck, maybe there IS a God, after all, then?

For the use case I was referencing Audio Books wouldn't be a problem because you'd just have a different reader for the different Narrator/Font.

Maybe. Who is to say? You could have the same guy, or gal, reading the same book, narrative, dialogue...I mean, if a book is so poorly written that it can't stand alone, with dialogue tags, but needs all this extra foofery...sheesh.
[/QUOTE]

[JSWolf]

Most fonts used in eBooks aren't needed. They are just there to be the same font as used in the pBook edition.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Most fonts used in eBooks aren't needed. They are just there to be the same font as used in the pBook edition.

Jon, dear, this may surprise you, but some of the participants here may have heard you mention this a time or two. Let the other children have time to shine, sweetie.

Hitch