03-25-2014, 10:32 AM | #436 | |
Somewhat clueless
Posts: 744
Karma: 9545975
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Oasis, iPhone 6 Plus
|
Quote:
QM has had so much success that it's completely irrelevant how silly it looks! /JB |
|
03-25-2014, 10:41 AM | #437 |
Bah, humbug!
Posts: 39,072
Karma: 157049943
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Chesapeake, VA, USA
Device: Kindle Oasis, iPad Pro, & a Samsung Galaxy S9.
|
I would never say that reality should make sense. We didn't evolve under a biological need to understand how things work on the atomic level, or cosmic level for that matter. It's a wonder our species of ape has learned as much as we have about things beyond the need to eat, sleep, and fornicate, but even so there's far more out there we don't understand and probably will never understand then there are things we do understand.
|
Advert | |
|
03-25-2014, 01:51 PM | #438 | |||
Guru
Posts: 826
Karma: 18573626
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Device: Kobo Touch, Nexus 7 (2013)
|
At this point, I feel like HarryT's point above, that quantum physics absolutely does not require a concious observer, already demolishes the entire basis of Lanza's book. However, at the risk of beating a dead horse, I will add a few bits from a review of Lanza's book by Steve Novella (a neurosurgeon who also does the Skeptics Guide to the Galaxy podcast).
On the requirement for a concious observer and the two-slit experiment: Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Part 1 and 2 of the review are available here and here, respectively. Last edited by Ninjalawyer; 03-25-2014 at 05:10 PM. |
|||
03-25-2014, 04:57 PM | #439 |
Bah, humbug!
Posts: 39,072
Karma: 157049943
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Chesapeake, VA, USA
Device: Kindle Oasis, iPad Pro, & a Samsung Galaxy S9.
|
Thanks for posting that, Ninjalawyer. You can always trust Dr. Novella to present a clear and devastating rebuttal of such arguments as those presented by Robert Lanza. The Skeptic's Guide is a great podcast.
|
03-25-2014, 11:00 PM | #440 |
Addict
Posts: 255
Karma: 2092424
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Arlington, TX
Device: Kindle PW4, Moon+ Reader on a cheap Android tablet
|
Since this thread has taken on a discussion of quantum physics, maybe a book recommendation is in order. As a mere interested layman, with no degrees in physics, the one popular level book which I think really gave me a sense of the workings of quantum mechanics was The Cosmic Code by Heinz Pagels.
Amazon Barnes & Noble |
Advert | |
|
03-25-2014, 11:04 PM | #441 | |
Zealot
Posts: 129
Karma: 2934438
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Winnipeg MB Canada
Device: aura hd
|
Quote:
|
|
03-27-2014, 10:45 AM | #442 | |
High Priestess
Posts: 5,761
Karma: 5042529
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreuil sous bois, France
Device: iPad Pro 9.7, iPhone 6 Plus
|
Quote:
|
|
03-27-2014, 01:27 PM | #443 | ||
Bah, humbug!
Posts: 39,072
Karma: 157049943
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Chesapeake, VA, USA
Device: Kindle Oasis, iPad Pro, & a Samsung Galaxy S9.
|
Quote:
Quote:
All that aside, I remember what I heard a caller to Coast to Coast with George Noory say on his show one night. The poor fellow called in after finding a cat in the house. He knew he didn't let it in, and his wife said she didn't let any cat in. "There's only one explanation," he told Noory. "The cat obviously entered the house from another dimension." Well, yeah. That would have been my first thought, too. Last edited by WT Sharpe; 03-27-2014 at 01:30 PM. |
||
03-28-2014, 06:06 AM | #444 | ||
High Priestess
Posts: 5,761
Karma: 5042529
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreuil sous bois, France
Device: iPad Pro 9.7, iPhone 6 Plus
|
Quote:
Quote:
|
||
03-30-2014, 01:32 PM | #445 | |
Cannon Fodder
Posts: 2,835
Karma: 50921712
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Probably a library
Device: PRS-350, Kindle DX, Kindle Paperwhite
|
Quote:
BTW: if you like hard science fiction, check out Greg Egan. |
|
04-01-2014, 03:17 PM | #446 |
High Priestess
Posts: 5,761
Karma: 5042529
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreuil sous bois, France
Device: iPad Pro 9.7, iPhone 6 Plus
|
The University of Chicago Press free ebook of the month is An Orchard Invisible and is about... seeds! A DRM's PDF unfortunately. No idea how good it is, but I downloaded it. And probably won't read it, just like all the others
|
04-05-2014, 11:37 PM | #447 | |||
Member Retired
Posts: 3,183
Karma: 11721895
Join Date: Nov 2010
Device: Nook STR (rooted) & Sony T2
|
Quote:
Quote:
Now, I said I would try to read and describe the chapter pertinent to the double-slit experiments which seem to be the crux of this discussion and the book. The question is "Does the act of knowing (consciousness) collapse the wave function, or is it a side-effect of the measuring apparatus?" The author describes three experiments that he says proves that it is the act of knowing that causes the collapse. Unfortunately I don't think I can do his explanations justice. However, as I understand it, I think the following link demonstrates a similar point as the author's: After a Short Delay, Quantum Mechanics Becomes Even Weirder Quote:
Anyway, I recommend Biocentrism to readers with open and inquiring minds. It's not perfect, but it will make you think. Don't be put off by the book's detractors who dismiss it as "crackpot." I suspect that their understanding of quantum mechanics is not as complete as they like to think. |
|||
04-06-2014, 05:23 AM | #448 | ||
Somewhat clueless
Posts: 744
Karma: 9545975
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Oasis, iPhone 6 Plus
|
Quote:
If consciousness was required to collapse the wave function, the interference pattern would appear and disappear as the experimenter chose to look at or not look at the detector output. This isn't the effect we see. Quote:
/JB |
||
04-07-2014, 10:26 AM | #449 |
eBook Enthusiast
Posts: 85,544
Karma: 93383043
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6
|
The fact that he's knowledgeable about biochemistry does not magically make him an expert in quantum mechanics. With the greatest respect to the gentleman (and to you) I'm pretty sure that I know an awful lot more about QM than he does.
|
04-07-2014, 08:25 PM | #450 |
Grand Sorcerer
Posts: 11,344
Karma: 35112572
Join Date: Jan 2008
Device: Pocketbook
|
Just remember this...
The model is always expendable, and should be eventually be expended. Observable facts aren't. |
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Hard Science Fiction Recommendations | tmclough | Reading Recommendations | 237 | 11-24-2013 11:46 PM |
Dell Streak - eBook reader recommendations please | Prodromoi | Android Devices | 4 | 06-22-2010 07:54 PM |
Any science (non-fiction) recommendations? | djgreedo | Reading Recommendations | 18 | 05-10-2009 03:42 PM |
ebook reader / netbook tablet recommendations wanted | maynard | Which one should I buy? | 7 | 04-12-2009 07:48 AM |