Literary Brideshead Revisited by Evelyn Waugh - Page 3

ccowie · 07-06-2015, 11:12 AM

I finished the book about a week ago and although much of it was read through a bit of post-surgery Percocet haze I think I really enjoyed the book. It’s the only Waugh book I’ve read and the beautiful writing has certainly motivated me to seek out a few other titles for future reading.
I wish I could write a little more, but I’m limited to one hand for at least a couple more weeks.
The Flyte family’s relationship to the Catholic church has been called an “addiction” in previous posts. I can’t agree with this at all. I think Waugh makes a good separation between the adherence to superstitions and being a slave to addiction. Sebastian’s relationship to alcohol is an addiction. It serves no good purpose in his life and keeps him from being the person all those who love him can envision him being. Charles never attempts to use logic with Sebastian to move him away from his addiction, but he does attempt to use logic as a means to move the Flyte’s away from believing that their religion actually has any power.
I think Charles’s conversion comes not because he’s now convinced that adherence to the ritual of religion brings about direct divine intervention, but that it has some very real comforting power in that the family have their belief in common. I think his own disjointed family relationships, particularly with his father, has something to do with his desire for belonging and Catholicism at least seems to offer that to the Flytes and perhaps to him as well. This would also make sense regarding Waugh’s own conversion. Someone has commented that he maintained support for the mass being performed in Latin. That may indicate a support for the comfort of tradition and universality the Latin mass represents as opposed to providing opportunity for deeper individual understanding of the pragmatics of the mass.

sun surfer · 07-11-2015, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ccowie

...I think Charles’s conversion comes not because he’s now convinced that adherence to the ritual of religion brings about direct divine intervention, but that it has some very real comforting power in that the family have their belief in common. I think his own disjointed family relationships, particularly with his father, has something to do with his desire for belonging and Catholicism at least seems to offer that to the Flytes and perhaps to him as well. This would also make sense regarding Waugh’s own conversion...

That's an interesting view. It's hard to know what Waugh was really thinking about Catholicism, but the family did have a connection to each other through religion regardless of how tenuous and this is especially enhanced since they were in a minority religion for the area. I can see Charles as you say yearning for this connection and bond and that even without the family, his memories of them could give him warmth and comfort through following their religion. This could also speak to the larger purpose of religion in society as well; besides the comfort of a divine being to worship and a set of moral rules to follow, religion gives people a community.

sun surfer · 07-16-2015, 08:41 PM

On another note, I definitely want to read more Waugh eventually but am not sure which would be the best next novel to read - Men at Arms/The Sword of Honour trilogy? Scoop? A Handful of Dust? His first published novel Decline and Fall? Or something else?

Bookpossum · 07-17-2015, 07:00 PM

Start at the beginning and work your way through is one way! If you want another about experiencing WW2, then read the Sword of Honour trilogy. If you want to cry with laughter, read Scoop.

poohbear_nc · 07-17-2015, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sun surfer

On another note, I definitely want to read more Waugh eventually but am not sure which would be the best next novel to read - Men at Arms/The Sword of Honour trilogy? Scoop? A Handful of Dust? His first published novel Decline and Fall? Or something else?

IMHO, next to Brideshead Revisited, A Handful of Dust is his next most brilliant work - funny, tragic, horrifying, jaw-dropping, -- you name it. The film version is also quite well done - Alec Guinness was brilliantly creepy.

sun surfer · 07-18-2015, 05:42 PM

Thanks both of you! So basically, either Decline and Fall, Sword of Honour Trilogy, Scoop or A Handful of Dust is what you two are telling me.

BP, I saw that you'd called the trilogy his other masterpiece, but then I saw Lynx-lynx thought it a little bland. That normally wouldn't stop me, but even though I love the time period I'm also a little burnt out on anything too WWI or WWII if it's too military-based, which I don't consider Brideshead Revisited (although, I do have some few like that on my tbr). I don't know how much those books resemble that but it gave me pause, along with it being a trilogy I'd be committing to as well. Given your view of it as a masterpiece though I do want to read it at some point.

Unless Decline and Fall gets a particular recommendation I suppose I don't see any need to start from the beginning with Waugh. He's an author I think I might like to read all the way through if I like the others as well as Brideshead, but there's just so much to read and so many authors I'd love to read through that I still haven't!

That leaves Scoop and A Handful of Dust if no one else replies. I can't decide right now from both of your recommendations so I'll add them both and see which strikes my fancy at the pertinent time, and the other will be the third Waugh I read. I appreciate the help; when I was looking at his oeuvre no one thing really stood out.

Bookpossum · 07-18-2015, 08:02 PM

That's probably because they are all so good! And because he's so good, he didn't keep on writing the same basic plot over and over as some writers do. It's a long time since I devoured his books one after the other, but I think poohbear is right about A Handful of Dust being a must read - I remember it was very powerful.

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07-06-2015, 11:12 AM	#31
ccowie Hiding with an ereader Posts: 391 Karma: 3987376 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Kitchener Ontario Device: Kindle Paperwhite, Sony PRS 950, Ipad 2, PRS 350	I finished the book about a week ago and although much of it was read through a bit of post-surgery Percocet haze I think I really enjoyed the book. It’s the only Waugh book I’ve read and the beautiful writing has certainly motivated me to seek out a few other titles for future reading. I wish I could write a little more, but I’m limited to one hand for at least a couple more weeks. The Flyte family’s relationship to the Catholic church has been called an “addiction” in previous posts. I can’t agree with this at all. I think Waugh makes a good separation between the adherence to superstitions and being a slave to addiction. Sebastian’s relationship to alcohol is an addiction. It serves no good purpose in his life and keeps him from being the person all those who love him can envision him being. Charles never attempts to use logic with Sebastian to move him away from his addiction, but he does attempt to use logic as a means to move the Flyte’s away from believing that their religion actually has any power. I think Charles’s conversion comes not because he’s now convinced that adherence to the ritual of religion brings about direct divine intervention, but that it has some very real comforting power in that the family have their belief in common. I think his own disjointed family relationships, particularly with his father, has something to do with his desire for belonging and Catholicism at least seems to offer that to the Flytes and perhaps to him as well. This would also make sense regarding Waugh’s own conversion. Someone has commented that he maintained support for the mass being performed in Latin. That may indicate a support for the comfort of tradition and universality the Latin mass represents as opposed to providing opportunity for deeper individual understanding of the pragmatics of the mass.

07-16-2015, 08:41 PM	#33
sun surfer languorous autodidact ✦ Posts: 4,235 Karma: 44667380 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: smiling with the rising sun Device: onyx boox poke 2 colour, kindle voyage	On another note, I definitely want to read more Waugh eventually but am not sure which would be the best next novel to read - Men at Arms/The Sword of Honour trilogy? Scoop? A Handful of Dust? His first published novel Decline and Fall? Or something else?

07-17-2015, 07:00 PM	#34
Bookpossum Snoozing in the sun Posts: 10,138 Karma: 115423645 Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Melbourne, Australia Device: iPad Mini, Kobo Touch	Start at the beginning and work your way through is one way! If you want another about experiencing WW2, then read the Sword of Honour trilogy. If you want to cry with laughter, read Scoop.

07-18-2015, 05:42 PM	#36
sun surfer languorous autodidact ✦ Posts: 4,235 Karma: 44667380 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: smiling with the rising sun Device: onyx boox poke 2 colour, kindle voyage	Thanks both of you! So basically, either Decline and Fall, Sword of Honour Trilogy, Scoop or A Handful of Dust is what you two are telling me. BP, I saw that you'd called the trilogy his other masterpiece, but then I saw Lynx-lynx thought it a little bland. That normally wouldn't stop me, but even though I love the time period I'm also a little burnt out on anything too WWI or WWII if it's too military-based, which I don't consider Brideshead Revisited (although, I do have some few like that on my tbr). I don't know how much those books resemble that but it gave me pause, along with it being a trilogy I'd be committing to as well. Given your view of it as a masterpiece though I do want to read it at some point. Unless Decline and Fall gets a particular recommendation I suppose I don't see any need to start from the beginning with Waugh. He's an author I think I might like to read all the way through if I like the others as well as Brideshead, but there's just so much to read and so many authors I'd love to read through that I still haven't! That leaves Scoop and A Handful of Dust if no one else replies. I can't decide right now from both of your recommendations so I'll add them both and see which strikes my fancy at the pertinent time, and the other will be the third Waugh I read. I appreciate the help; when I was looking at his oeuvre no one thing really stood out.

07-18-2015, 08:02 PM	#37
Bookpossum Snoozing in the sun Posts: 10,138 Karma: 115423645 Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Melbourne, Australia Device: iPad Mini, Kobo Touch	That's probably because they are all so good! And because he's so good, he didn't keep on writing the same basic plot over and over as some writers do. It's a long time since I devoured his books one after the other, but I think poohbear is right about A Handful of Dust being a must read - I remember it was very powerful.

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