Could this be the future of Amazon ebooks?

[bwaldron]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

OK... here we go. You "got real" about ePub before... now I am going to get real about Sony... the people that don't "trust" Sony are a minor vocal tech cabal that can't get past the "root kit" incident which was more attributable to incompetence than malice.

No, the rootkit thing didn't help their rep. But I am only talking about my personal trust in Sony -- don't care about others (though of course positive experiences from respected others can modify my views).

I have owned and liked many Sony products in the past. (Their service, though, was among the worst I've ever dealt with.)

My biggest issue with Sony as regards ebooks is what I went through with their Clie PDA line. Very nice products, but a non-core business for them that they just decided to drop abruptly. Similarly, I don't expect them to stay in the ebook business that long.

If the Sony PRS line were the only readers out there, I'd own one. Otherwise, no thanks.

[Patricia]

Originally Posted by Gideon

I know people get pretty protective of their brand choices, but the Kindle has been the best thing to ever happen for eBooks. Not because it's better technologically, but because it brought the very idea of ebooks to the masses and it did that doing what only Amazon could do:

• It's a company many know and trust
• It has the power and clout to force the book publishers into competitive and appropriate pricing
• it has the selection to make such a thing worthwhile

There are a number of people who remember that Amazon suddenly dropped Lit and pdf books, leaving a lot of people disgruntled.
https://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7223

[bwaldron]

Originally Posted by Patricia

There are a number of people who remember that Amazon suddenly dropped Lit and pdf books, leaving a lot of people disgruntled.
https://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7223

Yes, absolutely.

On balance, I trust Amazon more than Sony. But their record isn't spotless, and that is just my personal feeling based largely on my own experiences over the years.

And I won't buy digital content with DRM unless I know I can remove it.

[Badandy]

When is Amazon going to combine their Kindle store and their Mobipocket store? I'm itching to get the Kindle store available for my Cybook with their increased selection and better prices over mobipocket...

[TadW]

It would be nice to see Amazon exercise their power on publishers.

Is Amazon / Kindle strong enough?

I think Jobs was in a different position because at the time he was making deals, the iPod (and iTunes) had already gained the necessary penetration rate causing record companies to tremble in fear. On the other hand, when you listen to many publisher execs speak about the Kindle (or other e-book readers) today, it appears that they're not ready to acknowledge the demand for e-books yet.

[Over]

I don't think you can compare the ebooks with the mp3s, mainly for two reasons:

- mp3s are mainstream, ebooks are not (yet)
- mp3 piracy was and is mainstream, so removing the DRM was the only practical choice

And people have shown that if they are well served (DRM free mp3s and reasonable prices), they will do the right thing and buy the products, even if they can get it for free by illegal means. Sure not ALL people, but much more than you think. And certainly more than those who can endure DRM and ridiculous prices.

Right now, Amazon doesn't even want people with other ereaders to read their books, so I can't see Amazon to release DRM free ebooks any time soon.

[Barcey]

I think that the Record Execs bullied Apple out of the $0.99 per song / $9.99 per album by allowing Amazon to sell DRM free music. Apple had to offer DRM downloads or continue to watch Amazon's music download business grow.

I think that Amazon decided to sell DRM free music because it was their only choice if they wanted to sell music downloads against iTunes.

I agree with Gideon on how it's likely to play out but I don't believe that Bezos is the DRM Free Saint (I don't think Jobs was either).

Amazon wants to use DRM to tie people to their online store because they don't want to compete against other online vendors just on price and they recognize they can't drive enough additional value from their service. They'll only abandon it when they are forced to.

[TallMomof2]

On one hand I've had a couple semi positive to positive experiences with Sony and had decent customer service. For the one, a digital camera part of a *huge* recall, I was never contacted but had to ferret out the info myself. Once found I was able to ship off the camera and had it back 6 weeks later. Too bad I had to buy a replacement because my business would've gone under if I'd had to wait for it to come back. Also had a home theater system that ate DVDs and had to send that back in but they immediately sent out a replacement, still under the 90 day warranty, and that worked fine.

On the other hand the rootkit debacle, Vaio computers (overpriced and crippled), and the abandonment of the Sony Clie.

Still I didn't go with the Sony ebook reader because I didn't like the ergonomics and no dictionary. Plus Sony is in the gadget business not the book business.

[Gideon]

I wasn't thinking about the rootkit thing at all, actually. And I was also one of those people burned by Amazon pulling out of pdf.

My own reasons for not 'trusting' Sony is my experience with them when it comes to supporting their own products, but I recognize that to be an uncommon position.

I'm talking about the relationship you have with the company. Sony is a brand you buy, but it isn't who you buy from (not usually). It's not the relationship you have. I have a relationship with Best Buy, but I don't really have one with HP (aside from hating their products.) This is different from say, Apple, because even if you buy from someone else you deal with Apple when you have a problem with one of their products and thus can build a relationship with them and Apple has really mastered the art of creating that relationship.

Amazon, however, I've been dealing with for YEARS very regularly and they've always taken very good care of me. When there has been a problem, they've fixed it quickly and well. And that's not an uncommon experience.

But anger at Amazon regarding their ebook switch is something real, but like the rootkit, effects only a very tiny portion of the population.

But again - it wasn't just one thing that let this happen, it was many. Clout with publishers was vital, and so were the cash reserves to take a hit while driving the prices down.

[Daithi]

I've never had a problem with Sony, so I don't distrust them, and I do trust Amazon because I have dealt with their customers service in the past, and it wasn't a hassle. However, this wasn't much of a factor in my buying a Kindle over a Sony.

The main factor in my buying a Kindle was simply the fact that they had the largest selection of content. Prospects of future content was also strongly in Amazon's favor. The way I saw it, Sony's main business was selling electronics and Amazon's was selling books.

[alehel]

As far as I can tell (of course only those at amazon know) the only real reason the Kindle isn't available outside the US is becouse of the Whispernet which, as far as I've understood, is a vital part of the Kindle. If Amazon made books DRM free, they could start selling the ebooks on all amazon sites and people like me who live in Norway could read the ebooks on our own ebook devices. This is of course if Amazon at all has the rights to distribute these books outside the US.

The advantage to this would be that they would open up their content to a much larger audiance than what they have now. I for one doubt that the Kindle will ever make it to countries like Denmark, Norway, Sweden Iceland, etc. If the Kindle needs a contract with a phone company for their whispernet, why would they spend time on a country with just 4.7 million people living there. Not even Sony has bothered to release their ebook readers here, so our only choice is to import devices ourselves. No big electronics stores in Norway sell them, basicly becouse the Norwegian ebooks are crap. For one thing they use the PDF format which doesn't support reflowable text properly. Ebooks were in the papers here recentyl, but now they are being ridiculed becouse the company that got the rights for producing them messed it up. So having amazon remove the DRM and selling their books to us would certainly make me happy as I could buy an ebook reader the next time I'm traveling. At the moment I've only got my computer for this.

[manatheren]

My entire take on the Sony issue is they don't seem to play well with others. They do a very good job on the design and user interface side. Sony is usually the first to put new ideas into technology that everyone else soon copies. However take a look at the long list of sony developed technology that never got licensed to other manufacturers of which beta-max was the biggest oops on their part. Sony is great product for a premium price, but easily distracted by the next challenge in technology integration.

My experience is that sony all to often decides that the technology they developed is a dead end and then moves on dropping all support.

The other thing they have a tend to do is release a product and then release its successor in a very short period of time (CD and minidisc) CD's killed minidisc because it came out way to soon after everyone had changed from cassettes to CD.

In essence, Sony great technology, not the best business practices.

[pilotbob]

Originally Posted by Daithi

The main factor in my buying a Kindle was simply the fact that they had the largest selection of content. Prospects of future content was also strongly in Amazon's favor. The way I saw it, Sony's main business was selling electronics and Amazon's was selling books.

That's kind of contradictory isn't it? You bought a device from the company that you feel isn't focused on devices and used that as your justification?

Oh well, to each his own.

BOb

[rhadin]

Originally Posted by daffy4u

Bezos has stated that DRM is the publishers choice. As Amazon was big on selling DRM-free music, I believe they would sell DRM-free books if they could.

That is contrary to the ebook contract that Amazon wants publishers to sign.

[daffy4u]

Originally Posted by rhadin

That is contrary to the ebook contract that Amazon wants publishers to sign.

Do you have a copy of the contract you can post?