Anxiety With Scribd: Can a PDF be deleted after I've saved it to my PC?

[paperwhite13]

1. Everand deals with the library side now (subscription based reading/audiobook listening)

2. Scribd is strictly a PDF file-sharing site and you have to either upload 5 docs or get a subscription to download something.

Upload 5 Documents to Download
Upload 5 presentations, research papers, legal documents, or other documents to download for free.

* a subscription gets you access to both Everand and Scribd

[Marinolino]

Originally Posted by FatGuy

Hello everyone, I need advice. I know this is a strange question, but I'm still learning about how PDF files work so I'd appreciate any help to calm my extreme anxiety!

...
How can I make sure I'll still have access after my Scribd 30 day free trial ends?

Thank you for any suggestions!

You can save your pdfs as separate images (using some free or licenced pdf reader, pdf editor, pdf-tool etc.) and then later you can either read those images or create pdf, epub, djvu etc. files from those images, for your personal usage only.

[FatGuy]

Originally Posted by paperwhite13

1. Everand deals with the library side now (subscription based reading/audiobook listening)

2. Scribd is strictly a PDF file-sharing site and you have to either upload 5 docs or get a subscription to download something.


* a subscription gets you access to both Everand and Scribd

Originally Posted by Marinolino

You can save your pdfs as separate images (using some free or licenced pdf reader, pdf editor, pdf-tool etc.) and then later you can either read those images or create pdf, epub, djvu etc. files from those images, for your personal usage only.

Originally Posted by paperwhite13

There's no further need to check anything. See my reply above, if you were able to simply download it, it's yours to keep, there's no DRM.

Thanks so much for your replies!

The reason I got so worried about this is because I was worried that I'd be literally shackled to scribd.com's premium subscription service for the rest of my life because my PDF files or .TXT files that I've downloaded would be deleted if I ever canceled my subscription to scribd.com.

I already have wayyyyy too many monthly subscriptions and I didn't want to add on yet another one!

I hope this community can understand my feeling?

[Deskisamess]

This just seems to go against the terms of service at Scribd, and is no different than outright piracy.

"7. You may not make copies of all or any portion of any Subscription Content;"

"In addition to the foregoing, Your access to Subscription Content is conditioned upon timely payment of Your monthly or annual Subscription fees (“Subscription Fees”); and You will not have access to Subscription Content if Your Subscription is canceled, allowed to lapse, or terminated for non-payment."

[FatGuy]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

This just seems to go against the terms of service at Scribd, and is no different than outright piracy.

"7. You may not make copies of all or any portion of any Subscription Content;"

"In addition to the foregoing, Your access to Subscription Content is conditioned upon timely payment of Your monthly or annual Subscription fees (“Subscription Fees”); and You will not have access to Subscription Content if Your Subscription is canceled, allowed to lapse, or terminated for non-payment."

No this is not my intention at all. I simply want to backup the PDF files. It's possible the PDF files and .TXT files may be deleted from Scribd and then I'd lose the ability to read the PDF files and .TXT files forever...

These particular PDF files and .TXT files do not have DRM protection so I'm not even trying to defeat any form of DRM protection.

There are other files on Scribd that have this DRM protection but I have no interest in circumventing this.

Also, I'm only talking about 1 PDF file/.TXT file not a whole bunch.

I hope I'm being clear.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by FatGuy

No this is not my intention at all. I simply want to backup the PDF files. It's possible the PDF files and .TXT files may be deleted from Scribd and then I'd lose the ability to read the PDF files and .TXT files forever...

These particular PDF files and .TXT files do not have DRM protection so I'm not even trying to defeat any form of DRM protection.

There are other files on Scribd that have this DRM protection but I have no interest in circumventing this.

Also, I'm only talking about 1 PDF file/.TXT file not a whole bunch.

I hope I'm being clear.

It doesn't really matter if you are talking about 1 file or 1000 files. Whether or not the ebooks are protected by DRM also doesn't matter. Once your subscription to Scribd has expired, you no longer have the right to access those files. Any backups you may have made should be deleted when your subscription expires.

Trying to justify ebook piracy by stating "I am only going to pirate one book" is not helpful. If you downloaded a book from your local library, would you feel entitled to keep a copy after your loan expired?

[FatGuy]

Originally Posted by DNSB

It doesn't really matter if you are talking about 1 file or 1000 files. Whether or not the ebooks are protected by DRM also doesn't matter. Once your subscription to Scribd has expired, you no longer have the right to access those files. Any backups you may have made should be deleted when your subscription expires.

Trying to justify ebook piracy by stating "I am only going to pirate one book" is not helpful. If you downloaded a book from your local library, would you feel entitled to keep a copy after your loan expired?

You're completely missing the point because the PDF and .TXT files are all made downloadable by scribd. I'm not breaking any rules by downloading the PDF or .TXT files because Scribd encourages users to download the files locally.

The "Download Option" is impossible to miss if you looked at the website.

[Deskisamess]

Originally Posted by FatGuy

You're completely missing the point because the PDF and .TXT files are all made downloadable by scribd. I'm not breaking any rules by downloading the PDF or .TXT files because Scribd encourages users to download the files locally.

The "Download Option" is impossible to miss if you looked at the website.

You're being deliberately obtuse. And breaking the TOS of Scribd.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by FatGuy

You're completely missing the point because the PDF and .TXT files are all made downloadable by scribd. I'm not breaking any rules by downloading the PDF or .TXT files because Scribd encourages users to download the files locally.

The "Download Option" is impossible to miss if you looked at the website.

Perhaps you should check the definition of a red herring fallacy?

The question is not if you are allowed to download the file, it is a question of whether you have a right to keep that file after your subscription to Scribd expires. Going by Scribd's terms and conditions, the answer to that question is no, you are not entitled to keep a copy of that content unless you have a valid subscription in effect. This has nothing to do with your ability to download the file while your subscription is in effect.

I agree that the people telling you that you do not have a right to keep that file in perpetuity are correct. Your argument seems to be equivalent to arguing that you should entitled to keep a copy of a library loan after the loan period expired since the library allowed you to download the file.

[paperwhite13]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

This just seems to go against the terms of service at Scribd, and is no different than outright piracy.

"7. You may not make copies of all or any portion of any Subscription Content;"

"In addition to the foregoing, Your access to Subscription Content is conditioned upon timely payment of Your monthly or annual Subscription fees (“Subscription Fees”); and You will not have access to Subscription Content if Your Subscription is canceled, allowed to lapse, or terminated for non-payment."

You are confusing the ToS regarding the Subscription services previously offered by Scribd (now Everand) with its file-sharing services (PDF and text files uploaded by the community, free to download, copy and print). Here is what Scribd has to say about printing PDFs (making copies):

What can I print?
Any document that you’re able to download directly as a file to your computer or device from Scribd is content that you can print.

You can print:
Documents made available for download by their uploader

Here is the Scribd/Everand breakdown

What are the benefits of having a subscription?
With a subscription, you’ll have premium access to titles and features across all three of Scribd, Inc.’s products, including:

Everand: read and listen to ebooks, audiobooks, and more
Scribd: download community-uploaded documents
SlideShare: download presentations and other professional content

If there is a download button on the document page, you're free to save and print it and keep it even after the subscription has ended. Scribd lets you download it even without a subscription, by uploading several documents in return:

Upload 5 Documents to Download
Upload 5 presentations, research papers, legal documents, or other documents to download for free.

[paperwhite13]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

You're being deliberately obtuse. And breaking the TOS of Scribd.

If Scribd allows you to download a PDF for free, without a subscription (by uploading 5 documents in return), what ToS are you breaking?

[Quoth]

Simply using something, even if free, can be subject to restrictions. Though TOS may have invalid clauses no matter if a subscription or not.

If something is on your computer and works without the Internet it likely is no more vulnerable to remote deletion/blocking than anything else. Then the only issues are legal (may be civil or criminal law depending on country and content) and moral.

The validity of TOS / T&C has nothing to do with free vs subscription.
Our local library is free, but obviously has T&C as well as generic criminal legal protection from theft, abuse, vandalism.

Copyright books are often free, but you are breaking criminal or civil law (depending on location and actions) giving or uploading a copy. People need to get their own copy.

Also well established that sharing to get content that's organised by a website can be legal content, or copyright violation no matter what the web site claims.

Some content, even if PD can be illegal.

Whether or not you can use content or copy content is a separate issue to any TOC / T&C, moral or legal issues.

[paperwhite13]

Originally Posted by Quoth

Simply using something, even if free, can be subject to restrictions. Though TOS may have invalid clauses no matter if a subscription or not.

If something is on your computer and works without the Internet it likely is no more vulnerable to remote deletion/blocking than anything else. Then the only issues are legal (may be civil or criminal law depending on country and content) and moral.

The validity of TOS / T&C has nothing to do with free vs subscription.
Our local library is free, but obviously has T&C as well as generic criminal legal protection from theft, abuse, vandalism.

Copyright books are often free, but you are breaking criminal or civil law (depending on location and actions) giving or uploading a copy. People need to get their own copy.

Also well established that sharing to get content that's organised by a website can be legal content, or copyright violation no matter what the web site claims.

Some content, even if PD can be illegal.

Whether or not you can use content or copy content is a separate issue to any TOC / T&C, moral or legal issues.

This is the OP's question:

At the end of the Scribd 30 day trial, will I still be able to read and access the PDF files I've downloaded?

And the answer is yes, according to Scribd’s own ToS.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by paperwhite13

This is the OP's question:

And the answer is yes, according to Scribd’s own ToS.

No, the TOS is irrelevant for (1) below and may or may not be valid for (2).
1) If it's a downloaded PDF and it opens locally on a PDF reader (with no internet), then of course it can still be read.

2) The issue of should one keep and read files after a subscription has ended is completely separate.

[paperwhite13]

Originally Posted by Quoth

No, the TOS is irrelevant for (1) below and may or may not be valid for (2).
1) If it's a downloaded PDF and it opens locally on a PDF reader (with no internet), then of course it can still be read.

2) The issue of should one keep and read files after a subscription has ended is completely separate.

We're not talking about TOS and subscriptions in general, we're talking about Scribd's TOS and subscription service, and as such a lot that has been said is either wrong or entirely off-topic (while, ironically, accusing the OP of being obtuse).

The library analogy is completely besides the point: Scribd is a file-sharing service and the subscription only gets you an easier download, just like some other file-sharing services give you faster speeds with a subscription. The subscription has nothing to do with the right to read and keep the file, during or after it being active. Whether the download is a legitimate or a pirated PDF (there are plenty of those up on Scribd) is entirely between the uploader and the downloader.