Is this a horrible time to be a writer?

[Freeshadow]

ploppy & tgs altough I understand that you sort them out too, I'd nevertheless prefer not to mix the last categories with pbook owners

I sort the owners out because, no infrigement legit
you sort by willingly to leg. purchase which i as i admit not malvolent to the author but jet not legit.

in my case its not "book-piracy" , but "barratry" if they want to stick to naval legal termini.

p.s. how about the term bookaneer ?

[Moejoe]

Originally Posted by TGS

And also subtract those who are very selective in what they rip from the darknet. Although there are hoarders many people will not rip books that they can get for nothing or very cheaply legitimately. Even (some) nasty pirates have principles

All the ones I've met (virtually) have been avid fans and big spenders when it comes to fiction and non-fiction. They're mostly communities, a lot like this one, who gather to spread around their love of the written word. A lot of them have sprung up as methods to circumvent geographic restrictions by acting as sale-for-sale clubs.

[jaxx6166]

Originally Posted by Scott Nicholson

Well, if you have watched publishing for the last 20 years, this current era is the Golden Age. I can make a 70 percent royalty on my work now. I set the price. I decide what it looks like and how it is marketed. I can follow my instinct that I know my audience better than anyone else on the planet. How can this be anything BUT the best time to be a writer?

I've been avoiding this thread for a while after seeing it turn into another pirate attack.

But - let's get back on track for a minute here.

What Scott said couldn't be further from the truth. This is almost a magical time. I've googled my name, and set up an alert or two. The real kick in the ass for me came when I found out there's another indie author out there named David Alexander who isn't me. Dude's even got his own wikipedia page. Then again, I have yet to sell anything or market myself. I'm in the hobbyist phase. After being away from writing for almost six years, I came back in November and it still has that new car smell. I'm enjoying my time, I'm not killing myself working. I have a life, I have a dayjob. Would it be nice to make thousands upon thousands of dollars selling books? Oh hell yea.

But, the reality (as proven time and time again) is the current paper book market is dying. It all started when the local distributors were bought out by the big boys. Grocery store novels and local business owners that knew their market were sucked up by the super mega blockbusters.

The publishing industry is still operating as if television, video games, and the internet don't exist. I can't speak on a global scale, but it's my belief that American intelligence is pretty much in the shitter. And so are attention spans. Things that take creators days, weeks, even years to produce, are consumed in an almost minute-by-minute scale. What's hot one minute is gone the next and sitting in the recycle bin or the garbage.

Seriously, I picked up a Lee Child book because I couldn't stand to see it get thrown out (which was where it was going once the reader/original purchaser was done with it) Did I pay for it? No. Did I enjoy it? Yes, enough that I bought another one or two.

We're in this weird global internet thing now. People are finding that it's easier than ever to publish content. Some of the quality is debatable, but still. Those that choose (or are chosen) to walk with the small timers pretty much take their career in their hands.

Marketing is the ONE thing that makes or breaks a best seller. Would Dan Brown be a mega superstar if 60 Minutes and the sewing club didn't get all pissed off that he challenged established religion? Seriously. I don't think anyone bought Deception Point until it was reissued in MMPB after Angels/Demons broke big.

I've listened to best selling authors tell me that their sales were absolutely CRUSHED by the flavor of the week.

Authors are their worst enemies. We write. That's what we do. We're not marketers, illustrators, typesetters, etc.

Ask an author what his publicity plan is. You'll get blank looks, or spammers.

Look at Jeremy Robinson, Scott Siggler, and JC Hutchins. What set them apart? Robinson was a marketing genius. Hutchins was a controversial journalist.

What worked for them may work for another indie, but probably not. People get bored easily. Viral marketing was the thing to do for a while (Cloverfield) but that's old hat now. People are looking for the new "COOL THING ZOMG!"

Do I think it's a bad time to be a writer? No. Do I think it's an interesting time to be a writer? Yeah. Is it much different than the past? Probably not.

Look at all of the "Greatest novels of all time"

They've all had their moment in the sun, and what worked for them was that it was their time.

Dan Brown came out right at around the same time the church was going through its child molester phase.

Twilight came out during a time when the news was reporting a spike in teenage dating violence.

Dickens had the industrial revolution

Hemingway had the great depression.

Moral of the story: Fiction always mirrors reality. We've got all sorts of crazy things going on in the world today. This is an excellent time to be a writer. But, you need to realize the pitfalls of the pen.

You are your worst enemy. You are your best friend. Your career is in your hands. If you're not making the sales you want to make, reassess your goals. Are they realistic? Do I want to be a multi million dollar best selling self published author? Probably unreasonable.

Do I want to be able to pay the internet bill with the internet publishing? Maybe a little more reasonable. Find your stride.

Where am I missing money? Who's my demographic? Am I marketing to the right people? Do I need to spend a little money to make a little money?

You get the idea

[DaringNovelist]

Originally Posted by BillSmithBooks

I think that's the wrong question.

The better question might be, "Has there ever been a good time to be a writer?"

And the answer to that is unquestionably, "No."

Yep that's exactly it.

Writers have always survived by delusion. I also think that there is a certain amount of arguing about apples and oranges here.

I mean, for someone like Nick, the "Long Tail" model is not that attractive. He writes literary stuff that has potential for breakout. (Edit: I see that Nick has written genre stuff under aliases - so I would have to amend this to say "someone like I imagined Nick to be.") IMHO, odds are very much against people in that area to ever hit it in traditional publishing - but they do hit it bigger than genre writers. And more important, they tend not to do as well on the midlist. And with Indie pubilshing, you even lose the shot at critical success.

But I don't think that part of traditional publishing is being killed off by ebooks. At least not yet.

I also think that an awful lot of people have forgotten what the midlist really was. It's been pretty much dead for forty years. But it is the more natural way for readers and writers to engage. The midlist is where most writers used to make a living - with a slow, long buildup of a loyal audience. The midlist never had a publicity push from the publisher. It was often hand selling at first.

So I'll modify what I've had to say on this question: for midlist genre writers, this is a good time to be a writer and getting better. For people with very niche audiences, this is a great time to be a writer.

For literary and many mainstream authors... I don't think anything has much changed yet. It's about as sucky as it has ever been.

Camille

[starrigger]

Originally Posted by DaringNovelist

Writers have always survived by delusion.
Camille

There's a lot of truth to that, and in much of the rest of your post. However, on this one I'd have to disagree somewhat...

for midlist genre writers, this is a good time to be a writer and getting better.

For midlist genre writers, this is a really challenging time to be a writer. It has grown significantly harder in the last 10 years to make any decent money with traditional publishers, and in the last 5 years, it's gotten harder even to get a book out in paperback, much less distributed properly. Ebooks are not yet bringing in very much money, on the whole. I know a lot of people who have gone back to their day jobs, or stopped writing fiction altogether.

On the other hand, the new models of publishing may change everything. But most people I know are struggling to find the best way to adapt to the changes. I'm very glad I now have most of my backlist out in ebook form.

[DaringNovelist]

Originally Posted by starrigger

There's a lot of truth to that, and in much of the rest of your post. However, on this one I'd have to disagree somewhat...

For midlist genre writers, this is a really challenging time to be a writer. It has grown significantly harder in the last 10 years to make any decent money with traditional publishers, and in the last 5 years, it's gotten harder even to get a book out in paperback, much less distributed properly. Ebooks are not yet bringing in very much money, on the whole. I know a lot of people who have gone back to their day jobs, or stopped writing fiction altogether.

On the other hand, the new models of publishing may change everything. But most people I know are struggling to find the best way to adapt to the changes. I'm very glad I now have most of my backlist out in ebook form.

Perhaps I am looking forward too quickly - I am thinking of things going on _this year_ as a reversal of what has been happening - and specifically with ebooks and Amazon.

Also, I may be comparing from a much earlier perspective - I went to Clarion in 1982. All my mentors were people who had come up in the sixties and seventies. I watched the careers of a lot of successful friends completely die through the eighties and early nineties. To me, it feels like this last decade (specifically because of Amazon's efforts to bring small press and used books into it's model, and now Kindle) has a been an improvement in sf. For mystery, though (which is my genre) it still like it was for sf in the nineties. Barnes and Noble is still using the genre as a place to churn new authors.

So I guess what I'm saying is that all this stuff people have been bemoaning as the end of publishing and bad for authors is a very good thing for the almost dead midlist.

Camille

[starrigger]

Originally Posted by DaringNovelist

I watched the careers of a lot of successful friends completely die through the eighties and early nineties. To me, it feels like this last decade (specifically because of Amazon's efforts to bring small press and used books into it's model, and now Kindle) has a been an improvement in sf.

Camille

I haven't seen any improvement in the sf market in the last decade, except for individual, particularly successful, sf writers. There's been a steady decline. Except for sf in the media, of course.

Amazon is both a blessing and a curse to the midlist author. The availability of used books is great for readers, and for making it easier for new people to give your stuff a try. But it has killed the reprint market. And for books that are in print, it cuts into new book sales. It's hard to say whether the benefits outweigh the costs.

So I guess what I'm saying is that all this stuff people have been bemoaning as the end of publishing and bad for authors is a very good thing for the almost dead midlist.

I'm at a loss to predict. I think there'll be a lot of churn and upheaval. It may be that indie publishing will become the new midlist. It may be that the traditional publishers will find ways to reenergize the midlist. Some authors will find the magic, and some won't. I guess that's always been true. It's just that the board is changing.

[Marcy]

Originally Posted by starrigger

Thanks for buying my books.

For some reason, it's my life story that people want to call me "Steve." I once had a chance to get a book signed by Ray Bradbury, and as I walked away, I saw that he'd signed it to "Steve." I'm getting used to it.

I think it's because you used to have similar avatars. Before you had your books flashing I believe you had something with similar colors in a sci-fi-ish scene.

I really didn't feel a compunction to call you Steve.

Bye for now, Steve.

-Marcy

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by Moejoe

All the ones I've met (virtually) have been avid fans and big spenders when it comes to fiction and non-fiction. They're mostly communities, a lot like this one, who gather to spread around their love of the written word. A lot of them have sprung up as methods to circumvent geographic restrictions by acting as sale-for-sale clubs.

That fits with my observations too, but it is mainly fan-made ebooks rather than liberated commercial ebooks. Though the liberated ones are in there too of course.

Also, research shows that people who download unauthorised content from such places spend on average 20% more on legitimate digital content than people who don't download.

So maybe Steve's problem isn't that people are pirating his books, it is that people AREN'T pirating his books. Piracy certainly seems to be working for J A Konrath at the moment.

[Moejoe]

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

That fits with my observations too, but it is mainly fan-made ebooks rather than liberated commercial ebooks. Though the liberated ones are in there too of course.

Also, research shows that people who download unauthorised content from such places spend on average 20% more on legitimate digital content than people who don't download.

So maybe Steve's problem isn't that people are pirating his books, it is that people AREN'T pirating his books. Piracy certainly seems to be working for J A Konrath at the moment.

I believe Konrath would do well whatever he chose to sell, piracy or not. He's a great hawker, a blower of trumpets (mainly his own), a marketeer. What nobody ever discusses is the fiction he writes (at least I haven't seen it). He's traded in any sense of himself as a writer for the cash rewards of Konrath as brand. There's another thread on here asking "Has Konrath changed your life?" (or words to that effect) and I would have to answer, "Yes, he has. He's made me never want to read a Konrath book because I'm sick of hearing his bloody name all the time."

EDIT: And yeah, if you want to make money as a writer, the Konrath method is probably the path you want to follow.

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by Moejoe

I believe Konrath would do well whatever he chose to sell, piracy or not. He's a great hawker, a blower of trumpets (mainly his own), a marketeer. What nobody ever discusses is the fiction he writes (at least I haven't seen it). He's traded in any sense of himself as a writer for the cash rewards of Konrath as brand. There's another thread on here asking "Has Konrath changed your life?" (or words to that effect) and I would have to answer, "Yes, he has. He's made me never want to read a Konrath book because I'm sick of hearing his bloody name all the time."

EDIT: And yeah, if you want to make money as a writer, the Konrath method is probably the path you want to follow.

There's quite a buzz about him in the pirate circles at the moment, they see him as some sort of pro-piracy champion. I don't know if that is a deliberate marketing strategy or not, but I would suspect that he doesn't really want people to pirate his books, he just doesn't care whether they do or not because he knows that they are not having any impact on his income.

My view is that downloaders are no worse than people who buy used books or read books in the library, and have the same potential to increase future income as those readers. There are ways to make money from free content, so a writer with a bit of imagination could have the best of both worlds.

[Steven Lake]

Originally Posted by Moejoe

Here's my answer and I can't say it any less bluntly than this.

If you're a writer working with profit in mind then you are royally, unstoppably, irrevocably f**ked.

On the other hand if you're writing because you have something to say or want to tell stories to as many people as possible, then it's all dandelion fields and cloudless skies ahead.

Society has shifted, it's highly unlikely to shift back now.

Agreed. An income from writing is nice, I won't deny that. But it should never, ever be the primary reason for doing something. Too many people have lost that vision, always shooting for what makes them richest, not what makes them happiest. I've seen people who collect garbage who love doing it and are happy with what little they make. Well said, Moejoe.

Originally Posted by Worldwalker

Let me ask you this, Mr. Laws-and-more-laws....

Good points worldwalker. I've seen this attitude quite predominantly in the open source software world. Not from those people, mind you, but rather from the corporate entities fighting against it. Believe it or not, one of the things we learned early on, and we (ie, the FOSS community) have been trying to preach to the software and media corporate worlds for years is that DRM and other anti-consumer technologies DO NOT WORK, and are very counter productive. But once someone falls to the sickness of greed, they lose all ability to think rationally about things like this. I think the OP may have fallen to this sickness as well. I almost did a couple of times, and it's a horrible place to be.

And how do I know? Well, for one, his entire post screams of his fear that his works will be "stolen". Yes, they will. That's a fact of life. People will take your stuff every single time no matter what. Not everyone, but rather a small number will. Back in the print only days, how often did you see one book bought, and then passed around to 20 other people? I'd say that for every 1 million copies sold, at least 20% get passed around to 3 or more people. If the average is five, then you just lost out on an additional 1 million copies sold. And what do I say to that? Oh well. That's one million more people who've read your book, know who you are, and may buy your book next time around without anyone sharing it.

It's the same reason I'm sharing book 1 of my Earthfleet series. 1. I'd rather people read my book and gave me feedback on it, because it helps me get better at what I do, and the better I get, the more I enjoy what I do. 2. It puts my book out into the hands of more people, and the more eyeballs on words, the more people know about my writing, and the greater the likelihood that I'll find more people who love my works and want to read more of them.

And I'll say this again, I like earning a living from my books. It's sort of a monetary thank you for all my hard work and dedication. But if I never, ever earned a dime off my books, so long as people were entertained and loved the books, I'd be happy. That's the kind of attitude you need to succeed in writing. Success is not about how many copies you sold, or how much you earned, but rather how well you did your job, and how happy your readers are when they're done with your book. That's true success.

Originally Posted by HarryT

Only if you equate "writing" with "writing fiction". There are lots of jobs available for writing outside the fiction field where it's entirely possible to earn a decent wage, whether it be working as a journalist, an advertising copywriter, or a soap-opera script-writer. "Writing" is an enormously wider field than fiction writing.

Agreed. I've done tech writing, non-fiction, fiction, and a variety of others, and while I like fiction, especially science fiction, there are quite a lot of great opportunities for writers out there in the world, and they're increasing by the day. Just go to any job site and look at the number of writers jobs available. It's quite staggering. Now, if someone wants to write for a living and enjoy what they do, tech writing is an awesome field to get into. It's not easy, and you need a strong understanding of technology (you almost need to be an uber geek in some respects), but the payoffs are well worth it.

If you don't know how to do it, two areas I can suggest looking into in order to get free and valuable experience is 1) the Linux and Open Source Software sites. Raiden.net, the old tech site I used to own, takes in >90% of its articles from volunteers, and they were how I learned to do tech writing through a lot of trial and error, and the same is true of several other big names who have passed through the site. There's also a lot of well written articles you can look at that will give you some great ideas on how to improve your own technical writing.

Another is floss manuals. They're always looking for volunteers and they specialize in technical writing and documentation for Linux and FOSS projects galore. They're always looking for people to help them. It makes a great way to get experience, and a few feathers you can put in your hat and on your resume. Now as for Journalism, that's a tough field to break into, and the dynamic with that is shifting. If you're after a job with a traditional journalistic organization, you'll find yourself in an ever growing pool of writers fighting over an ever shrinking pool of jobs. The areas that are opening up and growing are via non-traditional sources such as news blogs, tech sites, social media, etc.

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

Then allow me to ask, Mr. Anarchy-at-all-costs:

Is Baen a writer?

Does David Weber already have an established print publishing resume, where he makes the bulk of his book profits? Will he still have that when print has been largely replaced by digital publishing?

Why don't you support laws that protect the rights of others?

Steve, I do support laws that protect the rights of others. But if there's one huge thing I've learned in the Linux and FOSS worlds is: 1. You can't control your customers. Especially in a digital world. Doing so is anti-consumer, and it just pi**es people off, and angry people tend to turn against you. As I stated in the other replies above, companies in the tech world who have become hugely anti-consumer are seeing a growing backlash by the consumers. Just look at how hard the music industry is getting crushed and how prevalent illegal file sharing is. (And no, it's not piracy, it's file sharing. Piracy is stealing an item and selling it for profit. File sharing is exactly that, sharing a file.)

Take a look at music industry sales. The harder a company pushes DRM and anti-consumer technologies, the harder people fight back. Look at the Sony rootkit fiasco. Or how huge the kickback against DRM has been. Same goes with the gaming world. I can think of numerous examples of this where a company releases a DRM'ed game in order to "protect their rights and profits". In one case, I believe it was with the game Crisis, for every DRM encumbered game that appeared on their network, three more appeared that were pirated. However, six months later when they removed the DRM, the piracy rate dropped by like 75% immediately and sales exploded.

And that's not the only time I've seen that happen. Or take the flipside of that. I know of at least two dozen indie bands who released their music (without drm) onto the file sharing networks and saw an explosion in their popularity virtually overnight because others heard their music, got to do a "try before you buy", and started telling their friends who in turn grabbed the music, liked it, and the vast majority who grabbed the "illegal" file shared copies bought CD's or digital copies of the band's music.

Steve, my advice to you is, lighten up. Writing isn't a living. Writing is a paid hobby. If you're doing this for profit, you're doing it for the wrong reasons. Give away some of your stuff. Share it with others. Offer it DRM free. And don't stress about others "taking your stuff". So what? The more people who grab your stuff, the more potential fans you'll gain, and the better off you'll be in the end. Also, given the way you've been acting towards your books, I think you need to take a second look at what you're doing. If you're doing this for profit, you're in this for all the wrong reasons. But if you're in it because you love to do it, and would do it even if you never got paid, then you're in the right field. The money is a nice bonus for doing what you do, but it should *never, ever* be the chief focus. Period.

[Lemurion]

I haven't read every post in this thread, but I have an answer to the original post:

I've been a major SF fan for over thirty years: I've read every issue of Astounding(Analog), Galaxy, and Worlds of If published in the fifties. Ive been to conventions, I've even shown up in costume.

Before I joined MR, I had never heard of Steve Jordan. That's a much bigger problem than piracy. No one is going to buy a book if they don't know it exists. Once that's solved, then we can worry about piracy.

[Scott Nicholson]

I've made all my books DRM-free at Amazon (except one that accidentally went through automatically before I understood what it was). I trust my readers and respect their right to be able to move the work between different devices. I give away quite a bit of stuff and throw articles and blog posts and fiction samples all over the Internet. I give and I get back. To me, it's all about community.

I foresee a day soon when ebooks are valueless of themselves--writers will need to make their money through ads and sponsorships and donations and other means yet devised. I'm not worried a bit. This gig has never been easy, and life has never accommodated writers. Readers win this round.

Scott

[Lemurion]

Originally Posted by Scott Nicholson

I've made all my books DRM-free at Amazon (except one that accidentally went through automatically before I understood what it was). I trust my readers and respect their right to be able to move the work between different devices. I give away quite a bit of stuff and throw articles and blog posts and fiction samples all over the Internet. I give and I get back. To me, it's all about community.

I foresee a day soon when ebooks are valueless of themselves--writers will need to make their money through ads and sponsorships and donations and other means yet devised. I'm not worried a bit. This gig has never been easy, and life has never accommodated writers. Readers win this round.

Scott

I don't think the readers are winning either.

Author obscurity cuts both ways. Readers suffer, too. What about the person for whom one has written the perfect book - but they never get to read it because they never learn it exists.

This is the one big benefit of the current commercial publishing model. It's far from perfect, but it puts books where readers can find them better than any of the other available models.