10" Likebook or Onyx Boox - how easy to use?

[Drou]

Hello, received some v helpful advice on this forum for myself, now need some help for my mother. She only likes reading large print books but I recently set up some books on her ipad for her to read during a plane journey. She loved the whole ebook experience and has been able to read alot more as she is no longer limited to the small selection of large print books in the local library. However she does want the text to be quite big so an 8" ereader would probably still be too small for her.

Moving into 10" territory seems to leave her with just the Kobo Ellipsa, or else an ink tablet. And tbh I think she'd probably get on better with a tablet. She's not a technophobe but as she's used to an android phone and an ipad I don't think she'd find an ereader to be intuitive - she's had her phone and ipad for a few years and still can't work some of the more advanced features of either, nevertheless I think sticking as close to their format as possible would make life easier for her.

The only thing is, I have read some comments from people saying that eink tablets are a steeper learning curve. For someone who has used 'regular' android, how hard is it to use the eink android version (sorry, not sure if there's a proper name for it)? Do apps such as Kindle look and work the same way (aside from the display obviously and perhaps the latency)? What is scrolling webpages like? Essentially is it pretty much the same as using a non eink android tablet? Finally, what is the reading experience like, especially in comparison to a kobo or kindle?

So that's the general stuff I was wondering about, on to the specifics! I think I'd only be interested in the Likebook P10 or one of the 10 inch Onyx (on my mum's behalf!), the main reason being these seem to be the most mainstream of the tablets and therefore there is a lot of info available for troubleshooting etc. And essentially I will be the one setting up the tablet and most likely troubleshooting when my mum can't work out what to do lol. Having never used these tablets myself, if it's a fairly different version of android to the one I'm used to, I'm not just going to be able to explain over the phone off the top of my head how to work something, I'll probably need to look for a video or in a forum for some help. So is either of these easier to use straight out of the box and will they need tweeking in order to be used as a decent ereader? If so, in what way?

In regards to how my mother is most likely to use the tablet, it would primarily be for reading fiction books (will mainly be sideloaded or borrowed from the library using the Libby app), maybe browse the occassional cookery book. I don't think she's into audiobooks and she definitely doesn't have to take notes but if she has the stylus I guess she might make occassional use of it. Similarly though, if she didn't have it she wouldn't miss it. Internet wise, she'd still have her ipad for her main browsing but I can definitely see her wanting to perhaps download and save the odd recipe or article from facebook or similar.

I would appreciate any general advice on how easy e-ink android tablets are to use and also specific advice as to whether an onxy book or likebook is better/easier, as well as how they compare to 'proper' ereaders. If any extra info is needed please ask! Thanks very much in advance.

[spacepope]

I had an Onyx 10" for about a week (unfortunately, it died and had to be returned...). I think this is enough to talk about out-of-the-box usability.

For me personally, I found it somewhat frustrating out of the box. Getting used to adjusting app settings (namely contrast) so that things would look alright took some time. You will also have to install dictionaries as the Onyx will come with none available, for whatever weird reason.


Once you're used to it, the device is fine, but it's not as streamlined as a dedicated e-reading device would be.

I don't think you'd miss the pen if you're not going to use the tablet for writing.

Also, web browsing is OK on an android tablet, but not as fast of course. I think it's fine for reading things like the news, but I'm not sure if I would use it as a full time web browser. It's sure better than the Kindle and Kobo web browsers though!


In my personal opinion, if you got your mom one of these tablets, I would gift it over a holiday when you're spending a few days with her. Let her mess with the tablet and then have you help adjust as needed. Once the initial settings are made, I think the tablet is perfectly fine to use - especially if you're already used to android devices.

[ottischwenk]

I have Likebook P10 and Boox Note Air.
I use Boox Note Air exclusively as a (winter) garden computer, because it is predestined for landscape format.
For books the Likebook P10, but not with the included reading application, but with the AlReader, because it allows special configuration of the touchscreen.

[Drou]

Thank you both, that's very helpful to know. As you both seem to have experience of android eink and proper ereaders, could I ask your opinions on how the tablets compare to Kobos and Kindles purely from a reading perspective?

[Pajamaman]

The onyx interface is easy enough, but not like normal android. However she could stay within a 3rd party reading app and never leave it. Alternatively you could install nova launcher which is a lot like a phone interface.

I too use alreaderx on the onyx, but i use alreaderx pro for eink. It has a simpler interface.

The onyx does come with a dictionary app, but it's not great.

FWIW I set up an onyx for my partner with alreaderx. She seems to go between the onyx hi and the alreaderx library system to find books. She almost never has to ask me help her. She can navigate an android phone no problem. Sometimes she get confused between the alreaderx library and the onyx hi, but the default app is set to alreaderx so it all opens in the same program. I set up the contrast options for her and she's never had to touch it.

[fduniho]

I don't have a 10 inch ereader, but I do have a Likebook Mars, and I can comment on the reading experience on an Android e-ink device compares to a dedicated ereader. It really varies by app.

Unlike my Paperwhite 4, the Kindle app has slower page turning than my Kindle has, it doesn't allow any custom fonts, it doesn't let you adjust the font weight, and it provides fewer font sizes. In particular, there is a huge gap where I would like some more font sizes. At least it includes a good selection of fonts, including Bookerly, which is one of my favorites for ereading.

As far as I can tell, the Nook app provides the same capabilities as a dedicated Nook. It includes a good selection of fonts, though no support for custom fonts.

The Kobo app provides only two font choices, Droid Serif and Droid Sans, and it does not support custom fonts. So, I prefer to not use it at all.

Google Play is fine. Like the Kindle and Nook apps, it provides a good selection of fonts but does not support custom fonts.

I frequently use Moon+ Reader, which is an Android app for reading books without any DRM. I am able to strip Kindle, Kobo, Google Play, and Adobe DRM books of DRM with Alf tools and calibre, which lets me read them on this app. This app supports custom fonts and gives fine-tuned control over font size and line-spacing. Instead of having a limited selection of preset font sizes, it lets you choose the font's point size with the precision of one tenth of a point. With the right settings, its page turning includes no animation and is as quick as on a dedicated ereader.

[ChunkierSky8]

I recently got the P10 about a month now and I would agree with the experience that the other person said about the Boox. If you are familiar with Android environment you can figure things out. The manual is poorly translated into English and really is not user friendly. I was able to figure things out after playing around with it. The biggest issue with the P10 is that it is slow to respond. If you are impatient, this is not the device for you. But I really like being able to customize it with the apps that I want to use with it. You can download Kindle or Kobo apps. The reading app that comes with it is great too as it offers a lot of options. You have to use the proprietary pen with it for notes Unless you are lucky to get the P10W with Wacom layer). I did have to install my own dictionaries as it only came with chinese dictionaries. In short, you will need to spend some time configuring it, and if yo are not tech savvy this can be a challenge. The advantage that dedicated ereaders offer is that it can work right out of the box. no need to download apps, etc. I like the Kindle as I got one for my mom who lives in a different country and I can send her books easily. I can manage her book content on the web. She is not good with tech and gets very frustrated with it. With her kindle it took her a short time to adjust and she really likes using it. She must have read close to 50 book so far this year. I use the SendToKindle apps to send her books from my computer that I got outside of Amazon. She just flips the case open and selects her book and font size and reads. The new Paperwhite models offer a bigger screen. Also it is waterproof. My om has the basic model and she is very happy with it. So, unless your mom is going to use all sorts of things, web surfing, note taking, etc. I think a dedicated ereader would be a better choice. And kindle allows you to send her books where the Kobo I don't believe it does that. Kindles also offer Voiceview, so she can learn to use that and red along as the device reads to her. Kobos don't do voice to text.

[Drou]

Thank you very much Pajamaman, fduniho and ChunkierSky8 for your additional insights. That's a good point about the send to kindle apps but unfortunately Kindle don't support Libby/overdrive which would be my mum's main source of reading material plus the screens are too small. It does seem like the choice is either get an android ereader and I'll have to fiddle around with it setting it up or get Kobo Ellipsa and let her fiddle around with it till she gets used to it! XD

I'm kind of blowing hot and cold re the Ellipsa - it would certainly be the easier option but our library uses BorrowBox and uLibrary as well as Libby - Libby is the main ebook platform and the other 2 focus more on audiobooks with a few ebooks thrown in. There's very little on either of the other apps that would not also be available from Libby but the thing that's making me blow cold is that since I joined this library about 6 years ago, they've changed their ebook app/provider about 3 times. I'm really hoping they'll stick with Libby but I'm worried that if they change yet again a couple of years down the line my mum will lose access to her main book source and will once again end up having to use the iPad for reading or I'll have to find a way to send her non-overdrive library books to Kobo. On the other hand, if the library sticks with Libby for the long term, a Kobo certainly makes my life easier!

[Toodu]

I have an P10w https://fr.shopping.rakuten.com/offe...pqRPMw793tC_qc, the wacom version I choosed. I satisfy their system (installed reader) and familiar from Mars, so I choose P10W after Mars. 10 inch is good for my PDF documents, it is more easy for me to have a review on it. But also can read comic. I get more on P10W than Mars.

[MarjaE]

I've picked up both while looking for affordable e-ink monitors.

As monitors: Frustrating. I can't get a good combination of smooth readable text, contrast, and speed.

As tablets: Easier, especially with practice.

On the Likebook, I was able to enable developer settings, turn off animation, turn on the option to show taps, and enable usb debuggging. The animation settings do not affect blinking cursors. The usb debugging allows Calibre to transfer files. But transfer apps can block Calibre. And some transfer apps such as Android File Transfer install malware that opens them every time you connect. I use usb to transfer files from Calibre, but end up having to use a usb stick to transfer files outside Calibre.

On the Boox, they hide a lot of these settings, so it's harder to set up. The same settings can help, if you can find them. Also the startup button is pretty unresponsive.

I also installed a few apps, including Hacker's Keyboard, which makes it easier for me to type, and einkbro as a browser. I use Andropen Office for writing, because I get migraines from blinking cursors and this usually hides them. Otherwise Kollabora or another office suite might be a better option. I sometimes use Orion Viewer for reading, instead of the Boyue and Boox viewers.

I bought an external keyboard, a stand, and a new lap desk with enough space and which keeps the stand from sliding off. I encounter a lot of battery drain using the external keyboard.

[Renate]

Originally Posted by MarjaE

I encounter a lot of battery drain using the external keyboard.

Oh! Don't do that. Hosting USB peripherals sucks down a lot of current. Bluetooth is the way to go. I use a Bluetooth clicker (which takes the same amount of power from the Onyx as a full Bluetooth keyboard).

Did I mention that I'm a proselytizer for Bluetooth?

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by Renate

Oh! Don't do that. Hosting USB peripherals sucks down a lot of current. Bluetooth is the way to go. I use a Bluetooth clicker (which takes the same amount of power from the Onyx as a full Bluetooth keyboard).

Did I mention that I'm a proselytizer for Bluetooth?

BT is a terribly badly designed protocol. I've only one BT Keyboard that works well and many hosts don't keep the keyboard paired anyway.
You can better proprietary RF keyboards and also use a USB hub + external power bank. I've done that on Android to add a mouse, keyboard and storage device.

Also many BT earbuds are an abomination compared to far cheaper wired earphones (and need charged). Unless the BT speaker or buds or earmuffs can use a lossless BT codec ALSO supported by the host, the BT is lower quality sound. Often lower quality anyway compared to built in DAC in phone/tablet/ereader/laptop. Also limited loudness on many earphones that use BT.

BT also can expose your location to sniffers and has had far more serious vulnerabilities than WiFi over the last 20 years.

Don't be an evangelist for tech when you haven't designed the HW and written software. Don't believe marketing depts.

Apple didn't remove 3.5mm socket for cost saving (20c) or quality, it was a marketing stunt and also to sell their x5 over priced BT buds, that need recharged and can't easily have batteries (cells) replaced. Also means they disable the FM Radio in the WiFi/BT chip because the earphone cable is used as an aerial.

Some USB perpherials take much less than your front light at 10%. Some can't get enough power at all.

[Renate]

Originally Posted by Quoth

BT is a terribly badly designed protocol. I've only one BT Keyboard that works well and many hosts don't keep the keyboard paired anyway.

There are plenty of poorly designed devices out there, but also many that work just fine. Unless you check, it's hard to differentiate devices that are the older Bluetooth Classic vs BLE. The original Bluetooth standard is 24 years old. Most things you use should be the newer BLE. Also, too many devices have too short a timeout.

I'm a big fan of USB also, but in many cases low power consumption on USB is hardly a consideration. Flash drives can take a lot of power. An internal SD card (when available) is a better choice.

Originally Posted by Quoth

Also many BT earbuds are an abomination...

No argument there.

Originally Posted by Quoth

Don't be an evangelist for tech when you haven't designed the HW and written software.

Mmm, I have.