Anti-Muslim Bias to the International Kindle

[zerospinboson]

Originally Posted by HarryT

That's not the case for electronics. They are mostly only sold within the USA on the Amazon.com site, only within the UK on the Amazon.co.uk site, and so on. I think it's a warranty issue.

Partially. Within Europe it mostly occurs because manufacturers know they can sell the same products at different prices in different countries (Pixmania does this a lot, refusing to sell products to people unless they have a postal address in the country the website is for, even though all of their products are shipped and sold from the same warehouses in France.)

[vivlio]

Originally Posted by luqmaninbmore

Greetings All,

I'm not trying to sound paranoid or anything, but I did notice that one thing that seems to bind together many of the countries in which the international Kindle will not be sold is that they are Muslim countries. The only Muslim dominated countries that I could find that could receive the Kindle are Albania and Bosnia, which are within Europe, and Tanzania which is in eastern Africa. It is not available for sale within the entire Arab world, even in countries with well-developed infrastructure such as the United Arab Emirates. India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, and even Bhutan can receive it, but Pakistan and Bangladesh are excluded. Ethiopians can buy it, but their Muslim neighbours in Eritrea cannot. It is available in Russia and Mongolia, but not in the Central Asian Republics. It is available in Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos, but not Indonesia or Malaysia (to be fair, Thailand and Korea are excluded as well). I don't think this is due to potential censorship, given that it can be purchased in Myanmar, Bhutan (which has strict policies regarding external media), Russia, India, Sri Lanka, and Zimbabwe all of which have issues with censorship. Am I rushing to judgement? I find it hard to believe that Pakistani telecoms are harder to deal with than those in India or Sri Lanka, or that the infrastructure of Morocco is lagging behind that of Mongolia. What do you all think?

It's not available also in Zeta Reticuli, Mars and Vulcan.
Amazon, how racist of you!
Andromedans will get kindle 2 through a third party deal.Lucky them...

[ahi]

Originally Posted by vivlio

It's not available also in Zeta Reticuli, Mars and Vulcan.
Amazon, how racist of you!
Andromedans will get kindle 2 through a third party deal.Lucky them...

Your post returned the thread to its former intellectual glory.

- Ahi

[Alisa]

Originally Posted by GeoffC

According to the Times newspaper (Thursday 8th October)

Kindle is Amazon's best-selling product.
Bezos expects sales of e-books to exceed those of physical books ; currently selling 48 kindle copies for every 100 equivalent pbook (5 months ago it was 35 per 100).
US e-reader sales 60% Amazon against 35% Sony.
e-book sales increased from $29.8m (jan-jun 2008) to $81.5m (jan-jun 2009) [world-wide or US not made clear].

I'm sorry but I'm going to be insufferably nitpicky. The Times actually said:

Mr. Bezos declined to offer specific information about Kindle sales. But he said Kindle titles were now 48 percent of total book sales in instances where Amazon sold both a digital and physical copy of a book. That was up from 35 percent last May, an increase Mr. Bezos called “astonishing.”

That's slightly different. If they had sold 48 ebooks per 100 pbooks, that would be 32%. That would mean out of 148 total books, 48 were ebooks and 100 were pbooks rather than 48 out of 100 total which is 48%. Sorry. I'm a dork. I can't help it.

[Patricia]

Originally Posted by Alisa

That's slightly different. If they had sold 48 ebooks per 100 pbooks, that would be 32%. That would mean out of 148 total books, 48 were ebooks and 100 were pbooks rather than 48 out of 100 total which is 48%. Sorry. I'm a dork. I can't help it.

There's nothing wrong with accuracy, Alisa.

[Phogg]

Originally Posted by ahi

Your post returned the thread to its former intellectual glory.

- Ahi

... which would be the same intellectual glory the starting post imbued it with.

Rather appropriate, really.

[Patricia]

Let's calm down for a moment. The original poster, Luq, raised a hypothesis, which wasn't entirely unfounded. It's been tested in subsequent posts. There's nothing wrong with that. Perhaps it might have been clearer if he had added a question mark to the thread title, but he explained his intentions. I don't really see the point of all the sarcasm.

[recycledelectron]

Originally Posted by luqmaninbmore

Greetings All,

I'm not trying to sound paranoid or anything, but I did notice that one thing that seems to bind together many of the countries in which the international Kindle will not be sold is that they are Muslim countries. The only Muslim dominated countries that I could find that could receive the Kindle are Albania and Bosnia, which are within Europe, and Tanzania which is in eastern Africa. It is not available for sale within the entire Arab world, even in countries with well-developed infrastructure such as the United Arab Emirates. India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, and even Bhutan can receive it, but Pakistan and Bangladesh are excluded. Ethiopians can buy it, but their Muslim neighbours in Eritrea cannot. It is available in Russia and Mongolia, but not in the Central Asian Republics. It is available in Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos, but not Indonesia or Malaysia (to be fair, Thailand and Korea are excluded as well). I don't think this is due to potential censorship, given that it can be purchased in Myanmar, Bhutan (which has strict policies regarding external media), Russia, India, Sri Lanka, and Zimbabwe all of which have issues with censorship. Am I rushing to judgement? I find it hard to believe that Pakistani telecoms are harder to deal with than those in India or Sri Lanka, or that the infrastructure of Morocco is lagging behind that of Mongolia. What do you all think?

1. Companies can choose where they do business. I decline business from CA or NY, while accepting business from TX, and TN. It's just easier that way.

2. The worshipers of Muhammed demand the death of anyone who reads the wrong book. Take "The Stanic Verses." Maybe Amazon doesn't want to have their employees killed.

3. The workshipers of Muhammed demand the death penalty for a person of the wrong religous beliefs reads a book, such as a Chrisitan reading the Quoran and not converting to Islam. Maybe Amazon doesn't want to be forced to ask their customers religous preferences.

4. The worhipers of Muhammed demand that women not be allowed to read books their husbands disapprove of. Maybe Amazon doesn't want to have to check with their customers spouses before allowing them to buy a book.

Go ahead and jump on me. I've been sentenced to death by a fatwah because I read the Quoran and decided it was the work of a genocidal crazy person. I have been shot at because my vehicle was stopped in front of a mosque. My oil light came on, so I pulled over and checked the oil. After doing that, a few shots hit the tree next to me. My gradpa died as a result of the 9-11 attacks.

Andy

[luqmaninbmore]

2 through 4 are simply factualy incorrect if applied to Islam; I don't know who these "worshippers of >uhammad " (SAW) are. Muslims worship no one but Allah. While the death penalty is continenced within Islamic Law, it is not applied for reading the wrong book or for not converting to Islam. The mosque you broke down in front of wouldn't have been in Iraq, would it? And you wouldn't have been in a military/paramilitary uniform, would you? My condolences for the loss of your grandfather; my grandmother died about a year ago and it still hurts me today.

[whitearrow]

Originally Posted by Lemurion

I think we can all agree that Cuba and North Korea are probably for political

There are trade embargoes on Cuba, North Korea, Sudan, Iran and Syria (you can't send anything there, with very limited exceptions that don't apply here) and technology transfer laws that apply to the rest of the world. You can't legally ship an X-Box to some countries without an export license, and for some countries, the hassle of exporting computer hardware and software may simply be so great that it's not profitable.

All of which is part of why I continue to believe that some Amazon corporate anti-Muslim bias is behind this, as opposed to a whole host of legal and technological issues, is just silly.

[AlexBell]

Originally Posted by luqmaninbmore

2 through 4 are simply factualy incorrect if applied to Islam; I don't know who these "worshippers of >uhammad " (SAW) are. Muslims worship no one but Allah. While the death penalty is continenced within Islamic Law, it is not applied for reading the wrong book or for not converting to Islam. The mosque you broke down in front of wouldn't have been in Iraq, would it? And you wouldn't have been in a military/paramilitary uniform, would you? My condolences for the loss of your grandfather; my grandmother died about a year ago and it still hurts me today.

Would that the gracious tone of your response was matched by some of the other posters on this thread.

Regards, Alex

[m-reader]

Originally Posted by luqmaninbmore

Greetings All,

I'm not trying to sound paranoid or anything, but I did notice that one thing that seems to bind together many of the countries in which the international Kindle will not be sold is that they are Muslim countries. The only Muslim dominated countries that I could find that could receive the Kindle are Albania and Bosnia, which are within Europe, and Tanzania which is in eastern Africa. It is not available for sale within the entire Arab world, even in countries with well-developed infrastructure such as the United Arab Emirates. India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, and even Bhutan can receive it, but Pakistan and Bangladesh are excluded. Ethiopians can buy it, but their Muslim neighbours in Eritrea cannot. It is available in Russia and Mongolia, but not in the Central Asian Republics. It is available in Cambodia, Viet Nam and Laos, but not Indonesia or Malaysia (to be fair, Thailand and Korea are excluded as well). I don't think this is due to potential censorship, given that it can be purchased in Myanmar, Bhutan (which has strict policies regarding external media), Russia, India, Sri Lanka, and Zimbabwe all of which have issues with censorship. Am I rushing to judgement? I find it hard to believe that Pakistani telecoms are harder to deal with than those in India or Sri Lanka, or that the infrastructure of Morocco is lagging behind that of Mongolia. What do you all think?

Paranoia with Capital P.
Occam's razor teaches us that the simplest explanation is almost always the right one. Your analysis is flawed in so many ways, it's not even funny.
Amazon would love to sell as many Kindle's as possible - to as many paying customers as possible. They are in it for the money, and that's the long and short of it.
Even without reading the Amazon explanation for non-availability in some countries I can tell you with a fair degree of certainty that this is due to copyright or network coverage issues.

[m-reader]

Originally Posted by recycledelectron

1. Companies can choose where they do business. I decline business from CA or NY, while accepting business from TX, and TN. It's just easier that way.

2. The worshipers of Muhammed demand the death of anyone who reads the wrong book. Take "The Stanic Verses." Maybe Amazon doesn't want to have their employees killed.

3. The workshipers of Muhammed demand the death penalty for a person of the wrong religous beliefs reads a book, such as a Chrisitan reading the Quoran and not converting to Islam. Maybe Amazon doesn't want to be forced to ask their customers religous preferences.

4. The worhipers of Muhammed demand that women not be allowed to read books their husbands disapprove of. Maybe Amazon doesn't want to have to check with their customers spouses before allowing them to buy a book.

Go ahead and jump on me. I've been sentenced to death by a fatwah because I read the Quoran and decided it was the work of a genocidal crazy person. I have been shot at because my vehicle was stopped in front of a mosque. My oil light came on, so I pulled over and checked the oil. After doing that, a few shots hit the tree next to me. My gradpa died as a result of the 9-11 attacks.

Andy

Andy sorry to hear about your grandfather.

However, you together with the original poster should take a massive chill-pill.
World sucks, lots of bad things happen because of many things. Take your pick. Throw a rock in the sky, you'll hit someone guilty and all that stuff.
I have been personally persecuted by two flavours of Christians solely because I'm Muslim. That wasn't very pleasent at all.
These things however should teach us to overcome and build a better world for our kids.
WTR your being shot at while stopping by the mosque, that sucks. An episode of Top Gear comes to mind when Jeremy and Co stopped at a service stations someplace down south in the US. They got chased, abused and stoned by a bunch of crazies because they didn't like their silly cars.
Seriously guys ... This is an ebook forum.

[Zealot]

I would suspect that it is a blend of reasons...

A lack of AT&T partner in the area, complexities regarding book copywrites and US bans on technology transfer all play a part.

For example, I know here in Israel Amazon (and most US companies) cannot ship any technology directly to consumers. That includes such things as DVDs. It may be a political question, a legal question, a free trade question or something else, it doesn't really matter.

Long and short is that the list of countries they do not ship Kindles to is not an anti-Muslim bias, or at least not unique to Muslims.

Z

[WT Sharpe]

Originally Posted by Patricia

There's nothing wrong with accuracy, Alisa.

Unless you're planning a career in politics.