02-09-2024, 02:25 PM | #16 |
the rook, bossing Never.
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I'm hoping for U-turn and that Wayland is scrapped. It's doubtful it can replace X.
See also Unity: Pretty, but awkward to use and hasn't delivered original goals.* UNIX user from mid 1980s. CP/M from late 1970s to late 1980s. DOS 1981 to 1990s. Teaching Linux and deploying servers and dual boot since 1998. Selling, configuring and supporting Windows from 1992 to 2004. Switched to Linux for all day to day workstation & laptop from late 2016. Erased Windows from laptop in 2017. [* Unity was discontinued in 2017] Last edited by Quoth; 02-09-2024 at 02:35 PM. |
03-04-2024, 10:39 AM | #17 | |
Grand Sorcerer
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@KovidGoyal: Thanks for keeping up the maintenance of this program. Even though I don't use it that often these days (my eBook library has been about perfect since 2016, barring occasionally adding a few new books), I'm always happy it's there when I need it. I'll keep some donations per year coming your way.
What are you going to do after Red Hat drops X11 support from RHEL 10? Because, no doubt you know... Quote:
In a year or two, IBM/RH will basically drop everything but GNOME, Wayland, and client-side decorations on LibAdwaita, and *FY* if you'd want to use anything else on Linux. KDE, as can be expected, is doing a good job in basically supporting everything under the sun: QT5, QT6, server-side and client-side decorations (AFAIK), but with Plasma 6, it will also move to Wayland as the default. ===== But I agree: Wayland is a joke. Why? (And I'm not even looking at implementations or protocols and concepts.) It was first announced in 2008 to replace X.org, because X11 was 'old'. Back then, X11 was almost exactly 20 years old. Wayland should have been the finished and the default on Debian 5.0 Lenny (2012), or Debian 6.0 Squeeze (2014) at the latest. However, it finally became the default in Fedora in 2016, but only when running GNOME on an AMD graphics card. It still isn't the default for most distro's in 2023/2024. It will become the default on Plasma 6, which will probably make Debian 13 Trixie opt for it to be default on every desktop that supports Wayland in March 2025. THAT is the point where I deem Wayland to be the default. But here's the joke: at that point, Wayland is 17 years old; just 3 years shy of the point where we'll have to start thinking about a replacement Last edited by Katsunami; 03-04-2024 at 10:56 AM. |
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03-04-2024, 10:45 AM | #18 |
Resident Curmudgeon
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Gotta love all these bits of Linux that don't work. Go Windows!
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03-04-2024, 10:51 AM | #19 | |
Grand Sorcerer
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With regard to Wayland:
Quote:
I do keep Calibre installed (Flatpak version), and didn't have a problem with it; not in X11, but also not in Wayland. The system is Debian 12, Plasma 5.27.5+hotfixes on Wayland, AMD graphics card, and Calibre 7.6 (Flatpak). Everything works as expected, except these three things: - The calibre icon appears when starting the application. A second later, a Wayland icon appears, and 10 seconds after that, the calibre icon vanishes. The application itself works fine though. - When opening an e-book, the viewer doesn't take scaling into account. The window has to be resized a few pixels for the book to be rendered to the correct scale. - The font-rendering and drop-down lists of the viewer's configuration is messed up. These things can be remedied as such, if desired: - Close Calibre - Install FlatSeal - Take away Calibre's Wayland permissions, so it renders on XWayland (X11) - Start Calibre === @KovidGoyal: why does the e-book viewer use a completely different GUI? Is it not written in QT? It seems that the GUI and GUI-fonts not rendering correctly under Wayland is a problem of this widget-set and/or GUI-library. If this could be fixed (maybe by updating the library if possible), Calibre would run perfectly in Wayland on KDE. Last edited by Katsunami; 03-04-2024 at 10:59 AM. |
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03-04-2024, 10:54 AM | #20 |
Grand Sorcerer
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I'd rather navigate something like this, than having Windows trying to foist a Microsoft Account and Edge on me at every other mouse click. If Windows asks me one more time "Do you want to....?" or it "makes another suggestion", I'll probably defenstrate my work laptop.
Updating my Linux computers at home takes about 10 seconds to update the entire system and all the applications. On Windows, it takes 10 minutes and two reboots to install a "Cumulative Security Update". |
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03-04-2024, 11:27 AM | #21 | |
creator of calibre
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03-04-2024, 11:41 AM | #22 | |
creator of calibre
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Quote:
I highly doubt X11 will actually become unmaintained just because RedHat stops using it. If it does and actually stops *working* I will see, probably end up writing my own wayland compositor, just like I currently have my own X11 desktop. Or maybe there will be some Wayland compositor out there that meets my needs, though I doubt it. I basically use only three graphical programs: The browser (written by myself, vise based on Qt), the terminal emulator (written by myself, kitty, renders straight to OpenGL) and calibre (maintained by myself based on Qt). So writing a compositor that works well with these three will be relatively easy and let me avoid most of the wayland headaches by making it actually consistent and well designed (at least as far as the core wayland protocol allows good design which is admittedly not very far) and tested for myself. The rest of the Wayland ecosystem can go jump off a cliff. |
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03-04-2024, 02:44 PM | #23 | |
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Quote:
My system takes less then 10 minutes to do Windows updates. It runs well. |
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03-04-2024, 05:16 PM | #24 | |
Grand Sorcerer
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03-04-2024, 05:32 PM | #25 | |
want to learn what I want
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Quote:
One tool I like is curiously called ShutUp10 - https://www.softpedia.com/get/Tweak/...ShutUp10.shtml |
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03-04-2024, 07:17 PM | #26 | |
Bibliophagist
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03-05-2024, 04:16 AM | #27 | ||
the rook, bossing Never.
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I expect it to implode at some stage like Unity did. It was going to be the only true way right till the day it was dropped in 2017.
Also Redhat is owned by IBM. If they mess up it will be like Oracle's Hudson and Open Office. See CentOS. Quote:
Quote:
No mention that Unity is essentially dead since 2017. |
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03-05-2024, 04:29 AM | #28 | |
the rook, bossing Never.
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Quote:
Also frequently takes ages to shut down or start due to applying upgrades. Upgrade system terrible compared to XP. Also doesn't ask if I want except for some, yet some break. My newest Laptop from Lenovo came with no OS. [*Best to have a VPN server in office or at home for using Public WiFi now due to MiM attacks which make the firewall pointless] Last edited by Quoth; 03-05-2024 at 04:32 AM. |
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