01-19-2013, 10:10 AM | #136 | |||||
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You didn't answer my question regarding the hypothetical news story. Would you immediately dismiss that as well? --Pat |
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01-19-2013, 10:42 AM | #137 | |
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Also, murray, you don't keep these actual sales figures in your head. You've researched them only now. So you're telling me when you first come across this story, you're going to immediately jump on it, even though at the time you really don't know what the Q2 2012 sales numbers are? Or the previous quarter's either? --Pat Last edited by PatNY; 01-19-2013 at 10:45 AM. |
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01-19-2013, 12:09 PM | #138 | |||
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I wouldn't dismiss it. I would, as you put it, nitpick it to death. Starting with the fact that one would expect a shortage of devices if the demand would have been underestimated. |
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01-19-2013, 01:36 PM | #139 | |||||
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CNET = estimates (Q1) NYTs = real numbers (January) Quote:
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--Pat Last edited by PatNY; 01-19-2013 at 01:38 PM. |
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01-19-2013, 02:22 PM | #140 | |||
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You are seriously saying that by pointing out the obviously huge flaw in the argument I'm essentially agreeing with it? |
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01-19-2013, 02:39 PM | #141 | ||||
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Semenza in the NYT's article is saying 19 million were originally ordered for January. So the NYT's is essentially saying it too. Quote:
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--Pat |
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01-19-2013, 03:32 PM | #142 | |
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01-19-2013, 05:11 PM | #143 |
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This might be irrelevant, but I'm offering a comment in case it helps:
These days, I often leave debates wherever they lie when the exchanges become compulsive, and both parties are expected to respond regularly, hour by hour, day by day, or risk being perceived as losing in someone else's eyes. Whenever the outcome seems to be that my petty point might be vindicated but the fallout could include singed egos and involve lasting resentment (I've had at least two people from message boards stalk me in real life), I tend to let things go. By continuing a strained debate, at the very least, I'm squandering energy best used elsewhere. (I could insert that famous "Someone on the internet is wrong" cartoon, but the point is so familiar to MR members that mentioning it seems enough.) Carry on if you like, but feel free to stop if if the going gets tedious or unpleasant. Last edited by Prestidigitweeze; 01-19-2013 at 08:29 PM. |
01-19-2013, 06:54 PM | #144 | |||
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No, I pointed out the part that was missing. |
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01-19-2013, 07:22 PM | #145 | ||||
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I'll repeat the analogy too: I called my local bakery last week Monday to order 20 pies for a party next week. Two days later I call back and cut that amount to 10. My baker tells his staff: "Pat had expected to order 20 pies for a party but cut that amount to 10." Sounds perfectly fine to me. Quote:
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Also, how does my statement you are referring to ignore that theory? My statement is consistent with that theory. Quote:
--Pat Last edited by PatNY; 01-19-2013 at 07:41 PM. |
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01-19-2013, 07:43 PM | #146 |
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I have *never* heard 'expected' used in that way before, is it normal in US English to use 'expected' when you mean 'did'?
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01-19-2013, 07:50 PM | #147 |
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01-19-2013, 08:14 PM | #148 |
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The "past perfect" "had expected" was an action in the past that was supposed to have been accomplished later in the past before other actions.
In this case the "later" accomplishment was negated (not done.) |
01-19-2013, 08:40 PM | #149 | |
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In this case, you have to view "had expected to order" in the context of the rest of the story. There is a stated number of 19 million as the original order. So if Apple hadn't ordered 19 million, then where did the number come from? There is also the fact that there are "cuts." Well "cuts" from what? There has to be a starting point that is higher. It all just fits. Interpreting it any other way within the story is illogical. And Semenza in the CNET article makes it clear that there were "cuts." --Pat |
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01-19-2013, 08:53 PM | #150 | |
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Apple really did order 19 million. But the NYT's reporter is saying that since the original order was amended it essentially was not completed. --Pat |
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