Which one should I get now?

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by rcentros

People often use "obsolete" for a product they -- personally -- don't like for whatever reason. It's a sloppy misuse of the word. It's meant to be a slur against an opposing product. I have trouble understanding this kind of partisanship. (Of course, I'm not big on taking sides with one political party or the other either.)

"Obsolete" means "no longer in use." The mobi format is widely used. Therefore it is NOT obsolete.

(Yes, I'm being redundant. Sorry.)

One definition of obsolete is "out of date" and Mobi is out of date. So yes, by that definition it is obsolete.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by rcentros

They're well formatted on my readers. I don't care how many rules you claim they break. I don't examine the code. I read the books.

They are NOT well formed on all of your Readers because they break the rules. That's why they don't render properly on your Kobo and nook Readers. Kindles are different because they are using Mobi which doesn't do the fancy chapter header.

The ePub is BROKEN!

[shalym]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

They are NOT well formed on all of your Readers because they break the rules. That's why they don't render properly on your Kobo and nook Readers. Kindles are different because they are using Mobi which doesn't do the fancy chapter header.

The ePub is BROKEN!

I agree that the epub is broken. You could spend time going through the code and fixing...or you could do what I would do, and just do a quick convert to mobi and fix all of the problems. If I want to read it on my Kobo (or other non-amazon device) I can just convert back to epub from mobi, and all formatting problems magically disappear.

It's nice how that works...

Shari

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by shalym

I agree that the epub is broken. You could spend time going through the code and fixing...or you could do what I would do, and just do a quick convert to mobi and fix all of the problems. If I want to read it on my Kobo (or other non-amazon device) I can just convert back to epub from mobi, and all formatting problems magically disappear.

It's nice how that works...

Shari

Converting the ePub, that's a good idea to try. I'll toss a Feedbooks book into Calibre and see how the ePub > ePub goes. If it works, I can have a look at the code and see how easy it is to fix it pre-converting.

P.S. OK, that failed. It kept font sizes at px and that's still broken.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

One definition of obsolete is "out of date" and Mobi is out of date. So yes, by that definition it is obsolete.

The main definition for "out of date" (which is the secondary definition for obsolete) is "no longer useful or acceptable." Obviously, since the mobi format is still widely used and accepted, "out of date" does not apply.

So, no, mobi is NOT obsolete. But your argument is.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

They are NOT well formed on all of your Readers because they break the rules. That's why they don't render properly on your Kobo and nook Readers. Kindles are different because they are using Mobi which doesn't do the fancy chapter header.

The ePub is BROKEN!

Well, there you go. The advantage I first stated for Mobi -- fewer ways to screw it up because it's less complicated.

As for the ePub format at Feedbooks ... why is it that Sony works perfectly and the Nook and Kobo don't? At any rate, Feedbooks' format (except for the Chapter Headings), as well as their Table of Contents, etc., all work well. They work much better than a lot of the ePub books I find (either in public domain or bought). So Feedbooks may "break the rules" but, apparently, so do many other ePub publishers -- and those publishers "break the rules" in such a way as to make the format really lousy.

So again, maybe the layer of complication bulit into ePub documents, makes the Mobi's simpler format inherently superior? It has been consistently better on my Kindles, than ePub's format has been on my other Readers.

[shalym]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Converting the ePub, that's a good idea to try. I'll toss a Feedbooks book into Calibre and see how the ePub > ePub goes. If it works, I can have a look at the code and see how easy it is to fix it pre-converting.

P.S. OK, that failed. It kept font sizes at px and that's still broken.

So what happens if you do epub -> mobi and then mobi -> epub? Does that fix the font size?

Shari

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by shalym

So what happens if you do epub -> mobi and then mobi -> epub? Does that fix the font size?

Shari

Chances are that would screw up the formatting and it still would be broken.

[speakingtohe]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Chances are that would screw up the formatting and it still would be broken.

Hasn't happened to me yet but then I have only done about a thousand. Are you speaking from vast experience in this process or just making a wild guess based on personal beliefs?

Helen

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by speakingtohe

Hasn't happened to me yet but then I have only done about a thousand. Are you speaking from vast experience in this process or just making a wild guess based on personal beliefs?

Helen

Because the chapter header cannot be done using Mobi. So the conversion to Mobi will lose the header formatting and converting back is then not possible to get back the chapter header formatted the way it was originally.

[shalym]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Because the chapter header cannot be done using Mobi. So the conversion to Mobi will lose the header formatting and converting back is then not possible to get back the chapter header formatted the way it was originally.

I actually DID do the epub->mobi->epub conversion on this book, and it definitely did fix the chapter heading. It no longer looks like crap when viewed on my Kobo, therefore it's fixed. Wasn't the header formatting broken in the first place? I thought that was why it needed to be fixed? If the formatting was broken in the original, why in world would I want to get it back to the way it was originally?

Shari

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by shalym

I actually DID do the epub->mobi->epub conversion on this book, and it definitely did fix the chapter heading. It no longer looks like crap when viewed on my Kobo, therefore it's fixed. Wasn't the header formatting broken in the first place? I thought that was why it needed to be fixed? If the formatting was broken in the original, why in world would I want to get it back to the way it was originally?

Shari

The only way to fix things is to replace the px numbers with em numbers and you have to play around with it to get it correct. What you are doing with the conversion is changing the way it looks. That's not fixing it. The issue is that the header doesn't properly display on all ePub Readers because of the CSS code using absolute numbers. So what's wanted is to change the numbers so the chapter headers display as intended on all of the ePub Readers.

[speakingtohe]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Because the chapter header cannot be done using Mobi. So the conversion to Mobi will lose the header formatting and converting back is then not possible to get back the chapter header formatted the way it was originally.

Odd. It generally works just fine for me. Not always of course, some books are pretty terrible.

I do know that you are a lot fussier about these things than I am. I don't actually care if my books are formatted as originally, as long as they are presentable. And I don't care about the underlying html as long as my reader doesn't choke on it. So if I want them as original I just leave them alone.

Often the reason I am converting is that the original formatting is butt ugly IMO. And when I was still reading, or attempting to read on my Aura HD there were a lot of books that displayed with weird font sizes and quadruple spacing that could only be fixed easily by converting to mobi and back again or laboriously by editing them manually in the html files. They displayed just fine on my Sony readers. Now I have lots of Sony readers so that is no longer an issue.

Anyway, mobi is not being actively supported, nor are my Sony readers, but I do not think they are obsolete, or even seriously out of date, any more than my 40 year old major appliances that still work like new.

8 track tapes probably 10 or more of the computers I have owned which cost me thousands each in the 70's and 80's are definitely obsolete, bu I am sure there is someone that feels differently.

We will have to agree to disagree I think.

Helen

[Rizla]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

besides for people who wish to sit in a circle and meditate on the nature of words

i.e. the majority of MR regulars, including you, in this very thread. Lol.