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Old 01-13-2015, 04:27 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by howyoudoin View Post
For all practical purposes, it is a file type. A mobi reader can read a mobi but not an azw that happens to be a mobi.
It'll read it if you simply rename the file to have a ".prc" extension, provided that the file contains a DRM-free Mobi book. It won't read it if the file has DRM, or it's a KF8-format book, of course.

It's rather different to the situation with "kepub" files on the Kobo, which really are a different file type.
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Old 01-13-2015, 04:35 AM   #62
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It'll read it if you simply rename the file to have a ".prc" extension, provided that the file contains a DRM-free Mobi book. It won't read it if the file has DRM, or it's a KF8-format book, of course.

It's rather different to the situation with "kepub" files on the Kobo, which really are a different file type.
Thanks, I did not know that.
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Old 01-13-2015, 05:22 AM   #63
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It'll read it if you simply rename the file to have a ".prc" extension, provided that the file contains a DRM-free Mobi book. It won't read it if the file has DRM, or it's a KF8-format book, of course.

It's rather different to the situation with "kepub" files on the Kobo, which really are a different file type.
Um, no. A kepub is an epub. A DRM free kepub will open with an epub reader with no problems. The kepub reader need a span wrapped around each sentence for the bookmarking system. But, it's just a span with a specific class and id. There are a couple of other things, but they are restrictions that don't break the epub standards.

Kobo do use their own DRM, but that just needs a different tool. And they do have a lot of DRM free books.
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Old 01-13-2015, 05:44 AM   #64
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Um, no. A kepub is an epub. A DRM free kepub will open with an epub reader with no problems. The kepub reader need a span wrapped around each sentence for the bookmarking system. But, it's just a span with a specific class and id. There are a couple of other things, but they are restrictions that don't break the epub standards.
Thank you for the correction. That's good to know.
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Old 01-13-2015, 10:11 AM   #65
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To paraphrase JSWolf:

But, you don't have to buy any azw from Amazon if you don't want to. Kindle handles standard mobi. So buying or downloading as azw is a choice that's not forced.
If you download a Kindle eBook that has both Mobi & KF8 versions, you will get KF8 if the program or device supports KF8. If it doesn't like the original Kindle, you'll get Mobi. You have no choice in the matter. None at all.

So where are you going to buy that eBook in Mobi that the publisher keeps locked with DRM other than Amazon? Amazon is the only shop that sells DRMed eBooks that for Kindles. And chances are, it'll be a KF8 eBook and not a Mobi unless your Kindle is just too old.
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Old 01-13-2015, 10:17 AM   #66
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If you download a Kindle eBook that has both Mobi & KF8 versions, you will get KF8 if the program or device supports KF8. If it doesn't like the original Kindle, you'll get Mobi. You have no choice in the matter. None at all.

So where are you going to buy that eBook in Mobi that the publisher keeps locked with DRM other than Amazon? Amazon is the only shop that sells DRMed eBooks that for Kindles. And chances are, it'll be a KF8 eBook and not a Mobi unless your Kindle is just too old.
Why does it need to be DRMed? Why not buy a plain old mobi?
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Old 01-13-2015, 10:28 AM   #67
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Why does it need to be DRMed? Why not buy a plain old mobi?
It doesn't have to be DRMed. But most eBooks people read come with DRM and thus, you have to buy from Amazon.
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Old 01-13-2015, 10:46 AM   #68
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It doesn't have to be DRMed. But most eBooks people read come with DRM and thus, you have to buy from Amazon.
It isn't Amazon's fault that other ebook stores do not sell unDRMed mobis.
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Old 01-13-2015, 02:14 PM   #69
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Thank you for the correction. That's good to know.
kepub is covered in the wiki.

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Old 01-13-2015, 02:17 PM   #70
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It isn't Amazon's fault that other ebook stores do not sell unDRMed mobis.
true but the prevailing opinion of new writers is that DRM is necessary to enforce their copyright so they require it and Amazon does not permit any publisher but them to use DRM. Thus in a way it is Amazon's fault, or at least their business practice. By comparison Adobe will allow any publisher to use their DRM but they do charge for it.

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Old 01-13-2015, 02:27 PM   #71
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It doesn't have to be DRMed. But most eBooks people read come with DRM and thus, you have to buy from Amazon.
I buy from up to 16 small independent publishers and none of them sell books with drm. I buy romance btw
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Old 01-13-2015, 02:57 PM   #72
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true but the prevailing opinion of new writers is that DRM is necessary to enforce their copyright so they require it and Amazon does not permit any publisher but them to use DRM. Thus in a way it is Amazon's fault, or at least their business practice. By comparison Adobe will allow any publisher to use their DRM but they do charge for it.
So, when it comes to the class books that are only published with DRM, you really don't have an open and free format. It's either Amazon's DRM or Adobe's DRM. If Amazon hadn't "rebelled" Adobe would basically have a complete monopoly. Not sure how Kobo's KePub format fits here. Does it require Adobe or is it its own proprietary DRM?
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Old 01-13-2015, 02:58 PM   #73
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I buy from up to 16 small independent publishers and none of them sell books with drm. I buy romance btw
Just curious, do most of these publishers publish in both mobi and epub formats?
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Old 01-13-2015, 04:52 PM   #74
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So, when it comes to the class books that are only published with DRM, you really don't have an open and free format. It's either Amazon's DRM or Adobe's DRM. If Amazon hadn't "rebelled" Adobe would basically have a complete monopoly. Not sure how Kobo's KePub format fits here. Does it require Adobe or is it its own proprietary DRM?
Amazon didn't rebel. If Amazon had rebelled, they would be selling eBooks with NO DRM. The fact that Amazon is selling eBooks with DRM means that Amazon gave in to the publishers that want DRM.

What I don't get is why bother with DRM? Tor went DRM free and they have come out and said that going DRM free has not cause any drop in sales. Going DRM free for Tor means they can charge the same prices and make more money because they no longer have to pay for the DRM.
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Old 01-13-2015, 05:51 PM   #75
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Would that explain why you claimed you refuse to buy a Kindle because Amazon is a closed ecosystem?
Neglecting to note that Kobo is also a closed ecosystem.


I believe I am being perfectly consistent, as I have stated my belief out in the open that any format for which there is a published spec is an open format, regardless of who used it first. Reverse-engineering is a perfectly valid way of breaking open a format.
Nor am I the only person to hold this opinion.

Which is more than I could say for you, getting indignant about closed systems and then buying a Kobo, which is a closed system.

Kobo
  1. sells DRMed books to the same extent Amazon does -- closed ecosystem.
  2. uses an internal proprietary and reverse-engineered (open to me, closed to you) KEPUB format.

I await your belated explanation for the disparity.
(I couldn't care less what you think, but please do not share your FUD with others.)
Once again, I don't make up my own definitions, so I don't have to defend them.

I certainly don't have to defend YOURS.

Not only do I not have to buy books from Kobo because I own a Kobo, but I can still use books I bought from vendors that no longer exist (such as Sony and Fictionwise) WITHOUT CONVERSION OR DRM BREAKING.

If that fits your personal definition of 'closed system' then I have no idea what you would mean by an 'open' one.
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